Is America today in line with the ideal of the founders?

[UsualName]

I came across this question from someone I went to high school with who teaches government and politics now.

He said most of his students said no but I say yes and he was pretty taken aback. We then had a pretty lengthy discussion and I‘m wondering if anybody here wanted to dip into this and share their thoughts.

I will give my thoughts later but I’m wondering what a broader opinion on this might be and don’t want to taint anyone else with my opinion - yet.

 

[Wallet]

NO

 

[TreeFrogTrader]

I will give my thoughts later but I’m wondering what a broader opinion on this might be and don’t want to taint anyone else with my opinion - yet.

Yeh, well. Regular viewers were sort of hoping that you might be taking a break from giving your view on this rather than setting others up so that they can be the straight men and then you can come in and blather on for another ten rounds.

Listen, Man. We got it. You think that looting and shooting cops is as American as Apple Pie. If Jefferson and Madison and the Tea Party Protesters were alive today they would be shooting up on fentynal, killing some cops, and going into Target.

The America that the founders envisioned was Mogadishu according to you.

Anyway. Like Biden, you have a script loaded into your teleprompter and are handing questions out to reporters. Let er rip. It's coming whether we want it or not. You know the thing as Joe would say.

 

[derektrader]

I think the kids today are taught unfactual or distorted history that fits a liberal narrative.
If they are told the truth perhaps their ideals would fall in line with the founders.

 

[UsualName]

Yeh, well. Regular viewers were sort of hoping that you might be taking a break from giving your view on this rather than setting others up so that they can be the straight men and then you can come in and blather on for another ten rounds.

Listen, Man. We got it. You think that looting and shooting cops is as American as Apple Pie. If Jefferson and Madison and the Tea Party Protesters were alive today they would be shooting up on fentynal, killing some cops, and going into Target.

The America that the founders envisioned was Mogadishu according to you.

Anyway. Like Biden, you have a script loaded into your teleprompter and are handing questions out to reporters. Let er rip. It's coming whether we want it or not. You know the thing as Joe would say.

You’re really good at being wrong and circling everything back to your man crush on Donald Trump. I suppose you can look at this from a societal view but this more of an academic question.

If you’re interested, stick around. Try thinking more in terms of government and politics as a science.

 

[UsualName]

NO

Why no? Where is the failure or deviation?

 

[gaussian]

No. The new form of corporate socialism and welfare for the elite is the antithesis of what they wanted. We can make a similar argument with our dependence on the federal reserve.

We are not a capitalist country. We are a socialist country. The only difference is our version of socialism is called Lemon Socialism. At least if we were actually socialist (as in money to the people) we could have a discussion on its merits. Right now the Everyman lives in a capitalist simulation while in actuality everything is being done to give welfare to the corporations.


This goes back to at least Reagan. There’s no one person to blame for how we got here.

 

[UsualName]

I think the kids today are taught unfactual or distorted history that fits a liberal narrative.
If they are told the truth perhaps their ideals would fall in line with the founders.

So the founders envisioned and codified three distinct interested parties in the nation. First and above all is the people, the the states, then the nation. Hence the House of Representatives, the senate and the president, respectfully.

So does the people have to reflect the ideal for the nation (America) to live up to the ideal of the founders?

It’s not an easy question you pose and I’m not sure there is a right answer. I would say no though.

 

[TreeFrogTrader]

You’re really good at being wrong and circling everything back to your man crush on Donald Trump. I suppose you can look at this from a societal view but this more of an academic question.

If you’re interested, stick around. Try thinking more in terms of government and politics as a science.

Oh. I see. Class is in session. You are about to instruct us from up on Mount Olympus.

I better study up so that I can understand your summary of where America is today compared to the founders views and intentions. What a shame they did not have you to tell them what the right answer was.

 

[UsualName]

No. The new form of corporate socialism and welfare for the elite is the antithesis of what they wanted. We can make a similar argument with our dependence on the federal reserve.

We are not a capitalist country. We are a socialist country. The only difference is our version of socialism is called Lemon Socialism. At least if we were actually socialist (as in money to the people) we could have a discussion on its merits. Right now the Everyman lives in a capitalist simulation while in actuality everything is being done to give welfare to the corporations.


This goes back to at least Reagan. There’s no one person to blame for how we got here.

Now we are getting somewhere! Bravo.

However, I would say no to you too. Corporate socialism is changeable through the will of the people and THIS is the reason I say the ideal of the founders is upheld today.

The ideal of the founders, in my opinion, was to give the people the power to change the nation as needed through continuous elections.

The ideal of the founders was never a social ideal but a power ideal - power to the people through the democratic process. And today that power, although under constant assault, is holding up.