Is a demo account waste of time?

[Turveyd]

Indeed that is the million dollar question. Indeed the usual material is not working. Most things that are common knowledge is like garbage, if it would work everybody would use it.
Some people are able to define the trend with very high probability, but most cannot. But those who know will not share.

It's not we that know how to don't share, cause for 1 do, I suspect it's more you/everyone is incapable of listening to anyone else's advice.

Although the first part is right, it's all total garbage, 99% use and 99% fail!

 

[kut2k2]

This thread is comical. People who do well in demo but fail with real money have psychological issues, not trading strategy issues. The notion that everybody can do well in demo is too hilarious to take seriously. The notion that only trading with real money teaches real trading is almost as hilarious. Trading is a mental activity and simulation training is always a good activity for that. Use demo or don't, your choice but it's a free tool and it strikes me as foolish to waste it.

The main issue seems to be discretionary trading. If you have a mechanical system that works (i.e., a mechanical system that kicks ass in backtesting), then there's no reason not to trust the signals in demo or live. Success in the demo will validate the success in the backtesting. Then you can make money with confidence. Touchy-feely discretionary trading is a whole different kettle of fish.

 

[bgk]

Why should there be any fear? If one knows what he's doing, there's nothing to be afraid of.

Fear of losses I think? Sometimes even when you know what you are doing,you are not certain of the outcome. You take risks.

 

[bgk]

Only in hindsight you can see what really happened with your trade, so you can know what you do (follow your system), but you never know the outcome in advance, so in fact you don't know what you do. That's the reason why some people have fear. Depends also from personality. I had a long time fear to trade, even when there was a very high probability that I would win big. So mathematically nothing could go wrong. But it went wrong emotionally.
Emotions can block even very successful traders.

Example 1: I am afraid standing on a roof of a 50 store building. Mathematically the possibility that something can go wrong is almost zero. But I am still afraid, mathematics cannot take away my fear. If I receive mental coaching maybe I will be able to control this fear.

Example 2: A young elephant was tied up with a thin rope to prevent him from running away. The young elephant tried many times but did not succeed. Many years later the elephant was still tied up with this same rope. He did not try to escape anymore because he was convinced that after trying so many times already in past he would never succeed.

Very good analogies. I hope dbphoenix understands what we are trying to say now.

 

[bgk]

Thankyou very much for your inputs guys. I am digging into them.

 

[Turveyd]

This thread is comical. People who do well in demo but fail with real money have psychological issues, not trading strategy issues. The notion that everybody can do well in demo is too hilarious to take seriously. The notion that only trading with real money teaches real trading is almost as hilarious. Trading is a mental activity and simulation training is always a good activity for that. Use demo or don't, your choice but it's a free tool and it strikes me as foolish to waste it.

The main issue seems to be discretionary trading. If you have a mechanical system that works (i.e., a mechanical system that kicks ass in backtesting), then there's no reason not to trust the signals in demo or live. Success in the demo will validate the success in the backtesting. Then you can make money with confidence. Touchy-feely discretionary trading is a whole different kettle of fish.

Never seen anyone use a mechanical system manaully or automatic which worked, its all touchy feelie to me.

 

[i am nobody]

It's not particularly challenging. If one can connect two dots, he can define a trend.

This is not about what the OP asked anymore but nevertheless interesting.
If you can define a trend you should be able to be profitable. But over 90% are never profitable. Does this mean that they cannot simply connect two dots?
You can define a trend but you never know in advance where it will end or how long it will last. But i can see critical moments where the change of trend can happen.
Connecting your two points will never go from the lowest low to the highest high (which is the full trend) so you can know the direction but not the entire move.

 

[i am nobody]

Fear of losses I think? Sometimes even when you know what you are doing,you are not certain of the outcome. You take risks.

Exactly!

 

[d08]

Sometimes people ask me: I have a very good system, should I first trade simulation or go immediately real?

I always answer them: First go demo. If you really have a good system you will be rich with a few months delay. If your system appears to be poor at least you will not be broke.

In demo environments, you don't influence the market while with real trades, you do. That's a big difference.

Demo is good for learning the platform, order types and getting comfortable with systematic execution but that's about it.

 

[Turveyd]

In demo environments, you don't influence the market while with real trades, you do. That's a big difference.

Demo is good for learning the platform, order types and getting comfortable with systematic execution but that's about it.

Although i rarely demo trade, i dont think 1 persons 1 contract is going to have a noticeable effect on the market.

Hard to get motivated to demo trade, too easy to make excuses and forget a few trades.

I think I was down 3k usd at my lows, over 8 years, it sounds a lot but its about 1.5% of my income over that time, most of that in the first year, got to risk it to learn IMHO!