Is 56 winners out of 64 total positions a good trading record?

Quote from bebe:

In professional money management, the winning ratio simply does NOT matter. There are many other factors to look at, one of the most important is your max. drawdown. If you win 85% of the time - but some of your positions drop 30-40-50% before becoming profitable - that is unacceptale, that is NOT trading - that is dreaming and being lucky at the end. You should know in advance when you will to take a loss ("I am holding this position until it finally becomes profitable" is unacceptable)

If your winning ratio is 85% AND you never lose more that 6-8% -
that is something to talk about. That IS trading.

Good luck!

I disagree....If you really KNOW what you are holding, then it is not "dreaming" it is waiting for the market to realize what you already know.

Why does someone buy a beat up old house? Because he knows that the neighborhood is getting better...n'est pas?
 
Quote from mrmarket:

I disagree....If you really KNOW what you are holding, then it is not "dreaming" it is waiting for the market to realize what you already know.

Why does someone buy a beat up old house? Because he knows that the neighborhood is getting better...n'est pas?
No, that's not quite it. My dad was in real estate, and the idea with fixer-uppers was to buy the cosmetically beatup house in the desirable neighborhood, not gamble on a wreck in a undesirable neighborhood on the chance it would work out. You wouldn't want to put a ton of money in a wreck, and you wouldn't want to hold that wreck for an indefinite period.
 
Quote from mrmarket:

I disagree....If you really KNOW what you are holding, then it is not "dreaming" it is waiting for the market to realize what you already know.

Why does someone buy a beat up old house? Because he knows that the neighborhood is getting better...n'est pas?

With a house you pay thousands in various fees, thus if you buy you have to be prepared to weather a downturn of a year or two.
With stocks you can get in and out by paying a few dollars commission.
 
Quote from roberk:

With a house you pay thousands in various fees, thus if you buy you have to be prepared to weather a downturn of a year or two.
With stocks you can get in and out by paying a few dollars commission.

Sorry...bad analogy...maybe no one understands me.
 
Mr market;

Might be a good trading record;
but in order to give an accurate answer more time & number info is required.
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Quote from mrmarket:

I disagree....If you really KNOW what you are holding, then it is not "dreaming" it is waiting for the market to realize what you already know.

Why does someone buy a beat up old house? Because he knows that the neighborhood is getting better...n'est pas?
:
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Actually your fixing up the ''beat up old house '' sounds even more profitable because;

certified real estate appraisers generaly have a MUCH better track record than full time or part time stock analysts.:D
 
No one understands you because you talk absolute gibberish.

Sir, you are a fool.

Yours
Factually correct trader
 
mrmarket,

Please tolerate my comments. Perhaps the housing market has markets within markets. Consider that in California for example it is an appreciating market and the value that you get might not seem to be the same value that you get say for example in Tennessee to use the extreme. It seems that supply and demand play a large role in this picture. Migrating populations, weather, jobs and local economies would fit in here too.

Point being: To draw the parable of buying good value and good objects and waiting for a assumed efficient market to discover your "safe entry" would be assuming that the market were not driven by short term outlooks and that you could quickly realize your goals.

Time is always a consideration, and to wait has a cost.....Entering cycles and limiting losses could vastly improve your model. Now I am not going to preach to you. Please don't throw your arms up and shake your head....I know you know what you know....ok? But consider trying to understand what others that have more experience than you are trying to explain. Just don't walk away thinking that people do not understand you. Rather than defending your position, which I know you believe in strongly ....your Huge I gather. I know your Wharton education has taught you it is impossible to time the markets and I am not suggesting to.

I urge you to just take a gander at this statement, then I will shut up....A stocks movement is 60-70% DEPENDENT upon the GENERAL MARKETS DIRECTION".

Go National (I am humming a ZZ top song, can't remember the lyrics)

Michael B.



Quote from mrmarket:

Sorry...bad analogy...maybe no one understands me.
 
Quote from mrmarket:

Mvic...thanks for your intelligent commentary.

The reason why I don't let my winners run is that I believe that my model selects new companies that are actually moving up faster than the company I just sold. As a result, this allows me to compound my profits to faster returns. You'll notice that many of my winners nail 15% in only a few weeks. If I can put a few of these together, the gains can be significant. By letting my winner run, there's a good chance that I'm actually cheating myself relative to other opportunities.



I do sell losers, I just haven't sold any in over 2 years. The 8 stocks I'm holding now that are "in the red" all have very reasonable valuations when one looks at their earnings and revenue growth, business model and macroeconomic potential. It's like holding a rare coin, a painting, or a zero coupon bond. I'm willing to live with the dearth of cash flow because I know that its true value will eventually be realized by the market.]


These two paragraphs kind of contradict each other. Why wouldnt you get rid of your losers and put your money in the stocks you mention in the first paragraph?

I
 
Quote from easyrider:

Quote from mrmarket:

Mvic...thanks for your intelligent commentary.

The reason why I don't let my winners run is that I believe that my model selects new companies that are actually moving up faster than the company I just sold. As a result, this allows me to compound my profits to faster returns. You'll notice that many of my winners nail 15% in only a few weeks. If I can put a few of these together, the gains can be significant. By letting my winner run, there's a good chance that I'm actually cheating myself relative to other opportunities.



I do sell losers, I just haven't sold any in over 2 years. The 8 stocks I'm holding now that are "in the red" all have very reasonable valuations when one looks at their earnings and revenue growth, business model and macroeconomic potential. It's like holding a rare coin, a painting, or a zero coupon bond. I'm willing to live with the dearth of cash flow because I know that its true value will eventually be realized by the market.]


These two paragraphs kind of contradict each other. Why wouldnt you get rid of your losers and put your money in the stocks you mention in the first paragraph?

I


Think of it this way. When I buy a stock it is a hot momentum stock moving up quickly. However, the stocks I buy also have very strong revenue and earnings growth along with fundamentals that make its valuation still reasonable. Most of these stocks I sell in a matter of several weeks, when I record a 15 - 20% profit.

Sometimes, not often, these stocks don't make it to 15% and languish. That's ok too...what has happened is that these stocks have metamorphosized into "value" stocks. Since their revenues and earnings are still growing, they are becoming better and better values. Many people like to invest in value stocks for this very reason. The positive return isn't as readily transparent, but it is almost certain. So, I hold them.

Also this serves to lower the P/E of my overall portfolio, which is a good thing from a risk protection standpoint.

Think of it like a supernova flaming and transforming into the black hole. You can't see the force of the black hole...but it is still there.

Good question, by the way.
 
>These two paragraphs kind of contradict each
>other. Why wouldnt you get rid of your losers and
>put your money in the stocks you mention in the
>first paragraph?

And that is the question several have asked. His response to me was that one (the still rising stock exited at 15% profit) was a "momentum" play and one (the floundering underwater stock) is a "value" play.

I didn't think the whole market thing was a word game. I thought it was about maximizing return.

And I will repeat the obvious that if you were to sell the losers and put that money into the stock you JUST SOLD at 15% profit you will likely do MUCH better overall. AND IF like you say you can do better with new entries than remain in the 15% up stock, then you can do WAY better with a new entry than in the floundering loser.

So, with your finest meat and cheese stock picking skills, I can only find one logical reason that you stick with the losers...you are more interested in trumpeting your "I'M HUGE and have XX WINNERS IN A ROW" than you are in maximizing your return.

But of course, it's your money (or not)

JB
 
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