Innovative Trading Get Real!
- Thread starter DaytraderDave
- Start date
smokey_mcPaat
Guest
well, you got fucked- better you hear it now from us while it is still early enough to find something better- good luck- and your deal is crap man- you can do way better than that.....
Received one or two messages from individuals saying, cool it, stop dogging the firm, your not informing your just basing them, and so forth. So I'd like to address some of the defenses that I've received via PM.
Note some people just got to personal, that I had to turn on the ignore option. So if I haven't responded, now you know why.
I've come to an theory, if I spent a few dollars for something they could have gotten for free, by just making a few phone calls or some research. Mentally if I had done that, I would try to come up with as many reasons as possible why it was a good investment, just so I don't feel stupid.
The ad that I was talking about on Monster.com is old, and that I'm stupid because they've made changes since it got posted. Search for Innovative Trading, you'll see that they've just issued a new ad for clients as of Oct. 7th.
Possible explanations:
Telling the truth would result in less inquiries. I mean think of it, "Pay us to Trade Your Own Money" "No Salary, but We Place You in an Office for a couple of Grand" and the list goes on.
And last note. They are still stating that their main trading office is in Redmond, WA. To the individual who keeps telling me that they are changing business models and their offices have moved to San Francisco, you have either been misinformed, you work for the company and have advance notice of this change making you a shill, or you have no idea what your talking about. My bet is a little bit of everything.
Baron, I would just as soon put a review for this firm, but the firm isn't listed in reviews section.
Last but not least. I started this thread, yes. But only to respond to questions that I had received about Innovative. Do a search on Innovative here at EliteTrader. You'll see Innovative has always trolled these boards, try to drum up business.
So Innovative, since I'm assuming your reading this, how about changing your advertisements. Make them a little bit more honest, then I'll stop, promise. Gives our industry a bad name when you pull stuff like you guys are doing.
Note some people just got to personal, that I had to turn on the ignore option. So if I haven't responded, now you know why.
I've come to an theory, if I spent a few dollars for something they could have gotten for free, by just making a few phone calls or some research. Mentally if I had done that, I would try to come up with as many reasons as possible why it was a good investment, just so I don't feel stupid.
The ad that I was talking about on Monster.com is old, and that I'm stupid because they've made changes since it got posted. Search for Innovative Trading, you'll see that they've just issued a new ad for clients as of Oct. 7th.
Possible explanations:
Telling the truth would result in less inquiries. I mean think of it, "Pay us to Trade Your Own Money" "No Salary, but We Place You in an Office for a couple of Grand" and the list goes on.
And last note. They are still stating that their main trading office is in Redmond, WA. To the individual who keeps telling me that they are changing business models and their offices have moved to San Francisco, you have either been misinformed, you work for the company and have advance notice of this change making you a shill, or you have no idea what your talking about. My bet is a little bit of everything.
Baron, I would just as soon put a review for this firm, but the firm isn't listed in reviews section.
Last but not least. I started this thread, yes. But only to respond to questions that I had received about Innovative. Do a search on Innovative here at EliteTrader. You'll see Innovative has always trolled these boards, try to drum up business.
So Innovative, since I'm assuming your reading this, how about changing your advertisements. Make them a little bit more honest, then I'll stop, promise. Gives our industry a bad name when you pull stuff like you guys are doing.
Trader Dave,
I trade through Innovative, why? Because I have commuted to the city for 3 years, no I trade from a private office 10 min away. I have 5 traders I trade with and all have been with Prop Shops previously. I have traded both with Bright and Worldco and have 100% more freedom than both of those "real firms".
The B/D we work with pays for our data line and offers rebates based on the volume we do. I did pay $300 fee for there services, but have saved this is gas this months. I have the freedom to trade equities, options and futures. Can you do that at other Prop shops? not with out a 75k account. That salaried thing is an attention getter and I knew better, but that is marketing. Hey It got them to inquire, so there market guy did his job.
Sounds to me, you are pretty bitter about something? Were you associated with this company and got dumped? You are pretty personnel about this stuff.......... I have cut my bottom line expenses by 20% and that is what matter most to me.....money in my account at the end of the month.
I trade through Innovative, why? Because I have commuted to the city for 3 years, no I trade from a private office 10 min away. I have 5 traders I trade with and all have been with Prop Shops previously. I have traded both with Bright and Worldco and have 100% more freedom than both of those "real firms".
The B/D we work with pays for our data line and offers rebates based on the volume we do. I did pay $300 fee for there services, but have saved this is gas this months. I have the freedom to trade equities, options and futures. Can you do that at other Prop shops? not with out a 75k account. That salaried thing is an attention getter and I knew better, but that is marketing. Hey It got them to inquire, so there market guy did his job.
Sounds to me, you are pretty bitter about something? Were you associated with this company and got dumped? You are pretty personnel about this stuff.......... I have cut my bottom line expenses by 20% and that is what matter most to me.....money in my account at the end of the month.
JeffGus,
Let me try to answer your questions.
a. You are stating that is alright that they say that there is a salary when there isn't because its all apart of marketing. Do you want to work for a firm with ethics like that? Making false claims a part of the marketing strategy. I guess they're will to do whatever it takes.
b. Again my history has been posted. We had discussions when they were starting out about some type of partnership, actually I was working for the larger firm at the time, but I disagreed with charging for training, and we moved on.
c. You have 9 total posts. You say you trade through them, and you've worked with other firms. But I believe that your relationship is a bit more deeper than that. Heres a quote from one of your posts in response to someone with less than 25k to trade:
****
"I have some options for you. My group works with a private souse of capital to overcome that 25K regulation. Contact me and I will see if we can work with you. I also have a capital backer that will sponsor traders with experience.
Thanks....Jeff
****
So you work for this group, that helps traders with less then $25K overcome that regulation, isn't that what Innovative does... and since you used the word we, and you seem to be recruiting, it makes more sense that you defend them. Funny how that works, I guess it is what you consider "marketing" not telling the whole truth.
And thats my opinion, just like the posts that you've put down in regards to Bright Trading and WorldCo, which wasn't in the most positive light. And if Innovative worked for you great, but my biggest problem is the Monster.com ad, like I said before, which I consider unethical and a blatent lie, but what you consider 'marketing'.
Let me try to answer your questions.
a. You are stating that is alright that they say that there is a salary when there isn't because its all apart of marketing. Do you want to work for a firm with ethics like that? Making false claims a part of the marketing strategy. I guess they're will to do whatever it takes.
b. Again my history has been posted. We had discussions when they were starting out about some type of partnership, actually I was working for the larger firm at the time, but I disagreed with charging for training, and we moved on.
c. You have 9 total posts. You say you trade through them, and you've worked with other firms. But I believe that your relationship is a bit more deeper than that. Heres a quote from one of your posts in response to someone with less than 25k to trade:
****
"I have some options for you. My group works with a private souse of capital to overcome that 25K regulation. Contact me and I will see if we can work with you. I also have a capital backer that will sponsor traders with experience.
Thanks....Jeff
****
So you work for this group, that helps traders with less then $25K overcome that regulation, isn't that what Innovative does... and since you used the word we, and you seem to be recruiting, it makes more sense that you defend them. Funny how that works, I guess it is what you consider "marketing" not telling the whole truth.
And thats my opinion, just like the posts that you've put down in regards to Bright Trading and WorldCo, which wasn't in the most positive light. And if Innovative worked for you great, but my biggest problem is the Monster.com ad, like I said before, which I consider unethical and a blatent lie, but what you consider 'marketing'.
smokey_mcPaat
Guest
i like your style, daytraderdave- good work
Your assumptions are quite wrong. I have a private backer that Is a old trader from the floor. With his initially CAPITAL, a small contribution by the traders and the leverage provided by the relationship with Innovative Is a dream come true.
I have cut my clearing expenses by 25% and now keep ALL my profits. I run my own office, Have Backed 3 young traders that would have not been in this great game if these relationships were not built. I do not charge for training, but just spent over 30K to acquire a masters degree from Golden Gate University with an emphasis on technical analysis and will be finishing up my CMT program this year.
If you what to talk SHIT, why not start with all these Prop Houses that bring on green traders, milk their cash with ticket charges, high bullets and don't teach them anything about a trading plan, developing an edge, and risk to reward expectations.
My friend, talk all you want. The opportunity you passed up on will be a very bad decision 12 months from now. I can see you are regretting that decision by the time you have spent undermining their business. The business is changing and the environment and playing field is becoming level. Sorry Pal, you missed a great opportunity.
And by the way, payment for education is the foundation of our higher education. You pay your tuition to the market or a fee to a trader who has already made those mistakes and will keep you for that pain.
I have tried both, and working with an experienced trader is a quicker learning curve, and you can avoid all the mental pain. Keep talking, you are doing some great media work for these guys. Keep up the good work.
I have cut my clearing expenses by 25% and now keep ALL my profits. I run my own office, Have Backed 3 young traders that would have not been in this great game if these relationships were not built. I do not charge for training, but just spent over 30K to acquire a masters degree from Golden Gate University with an emphasis on technical analysis and will be finishing up my CMT program this year.
If you what to talk SHIT, why not start with all these Prop Houses that bring on green traders, milk their cash with ticket charges, high bullets and don't teach them anything about a trading plan, developing an edge, and risk to reward expectations.
My friend, talk all you want. The opportunity you passed up on will be a very bad decision 12 months from now. I can see you are regretting that decision by the time you have spent undermining their business. The business is changing and the environment and playing field is becoming level. Sorry Pal, you missed a great opportunity.
And by the way, payment for education is the foundation of our higher education. You pay your tuition to the market or a fee to a trader who has already made those mistakes and will keep you for that pain.
I have tried both, and working with an experienced trader is a quicker learning curve, and you can avoid all the mental pain. Keep talking, you are doing some great media work for these guys. Keep up the good work.
Alright... point #1. Your defending them fine. You've made it clear to everyone reading that you support them and there marketing practices. Did you know that the FOUNDER of Innovative Trading, was not a profitable trader, and at the time the firm was founded he wasn't a full time trader, but a trainer.
Did you know his partner who owned the firm that it was started in, almost shut it down a few times, had no volume in the office, was clearing trades on a per ticket basis, and has computers that are over three years old as the norm. Those are the facts. You say I missed the boat, but when you see something that reminds you of the Titanic, the smart money is missing the boat.
Now, I can see that you have a deep relationship with them with a lot of money invested in them. Did you know that if you had the volume and a private office like you said, you could actually get cheaper rates by bypassing them and going directly to the clearing firm, I mean if you are a profitable office with volume, but then again we've already determined your a shill recruiting on the site. The old firm cleared through US Trading, which last year didn't even offer them a per share basis for clearing.
This is a thread about Innovative, not Bright, not Echo, not any other firm. You have problems with those firms, you post in those threads to educate and offer your opinion to people who are interested. And you've done this, along with saying something like, "I can get you trading for less than $25k, plus give you backing," either your stupid or you work for Innovative and your "marketing", cause who in the world would offer to back a trader that they've seen two posts on EliteTrader. If your really doing that you should start a thread... you'll become huge, everyone would be willing to loose money for you. But my guess is your doing the good old bait and switch.
But it doesn't seem you can take the heat, because your resorting to swearing, back-tracking, and ignoring the clear statement that Innovative Trading uses unethical methods to recruit traders.
BAD ETHICS + HIGH COMMISSIONS + CHARGING FOR TRAINING + GETTING A CUT OF COMMISSIONS + LYING ABOUT A SALARY AND AVG RETURNS + RISKING YOUR OWN CAPITAL = Innovative Trading, this formula is truely innovative.
It's great to see some discussion about this, especially from Innovative directly, I mean look at JeffGus's posts all try to recruit or dog other firms. I choose to stick with what I know, Innovative Trading, where someone is sure to make money, just not always you.
Did you know his partner who owned the firm that it was started in, almost shut it down a few times, had no volume in the office, was clearing trades on a per ticket basis, and has computers that are over three years old as the norm. Those are the facts. You say I missed the boat, but when you see something that reminds you of the Titanic, the smart money is missing the boat.
Now, I can see that you have a deep relationship with them with a lot of money invested in them. Did you know that if you had the volume and a private office like you said, you could actually get cheaper rates by bypassing them and going directly to the clearing firm, I mean if you are a profitable office with volume, but then again we've already determined your a shill recruiting on the site. The old firm cleared through US Trading, which last year didn't even offer them a per share basis for clearing.
This is a thread about Innovative, not Bright, not Echo, not any other firm. You have problems with those firms, you post in those threads to educate and offer your opinion to people who are interested. And you've done this, along with saying something like, "I can get you trading for less than $25k, plus give you backing," either your stupid or you work for Innovative and your "marketing", cause who in the world would offer to back a trader that they've seen two posts on EliteTrader. If your really doing that you should start a thread... you'll become huge, everyone would be willing to loose money for you. But my guess is your doing the good old bait and switch.
But it doesn't seem you can take the heat, because your resorting to swearing, back-tracking, and ignoring the clear statement that Innovative Trading uses unethical methods to recruit traders.
BAD ETHICS + HIGH COMMISSIONS + CHARGING FOR TRAINING + GETTING A CUT OF COMMISSIONS + LYING ABOUT A SALARY AND AVG RETURNS + RISKING YOUR OWN CAPITAL = Innovative Trading, this formula is truely innovative.
It's great to see some discussion about this, especially from Innovative directly, I mean look at JeffGus's posts all try to recruit or dog other firms. I choose to stick with what I know, Innovative Trading, where someone is sure to make money, just not always you.
You speak the truth brother!