I'm sick and tired of work! :)

Quote from cashmoney69:

I agree with the business part, but don't make him think that he's gotta sit in front of the computer all day watching every tick if he's not a true day trader. About 80% of my day is watching and waiting. Very few times do I pull the trigger, as most my time is spent looking through the scope :) .

That's just what I mean, too many people just think about being in the markets actively trading as working. There is so much "off the ball" work required to become successful. Yes screen time is a good portion of it, but there is much more that makes CONSISTANT SUCCESSFUL TRADING a full time job.

I rarely daytrade, but I am easily in my home office 36 - 50 hours per week.
 
Quote from Algorithm:

That's just what I mean, too many people just think about being in the markets actively trading as working. There is so much "off the ball" work required to become successful. Yes screen time is a good portion of it, but there is much more that makes CONSISTANT SUCCESSFUL TRADING a full time job.

I rarely daytrade, but I am easily in my home office 36 - 50 hours per week.

Thanks

edit: if there ever was a "secret", you just gave it to'em.

Best Regards,

JJ
 
Quote from tradertony76:

By the way, to go back to elit's original post.

Be aware you are most likely in for the most difficult journey of your life.

I also got interested back in 2001, while working in IT. I spent a few years reading everything I could find and dabbling around with charts and making small stock trades.

I'll share a bit of my journey from IT to trading with you.

In 2004, I decided to pursue trading full time. So I wasnt just dont trading, I also enrolled in a masters program in "financial markets", so that I could learn more and meet folks in the industry.

In mid-2006 I decided since I could not get into trading firms anywhere I would start doing simulated trading on my own.

I'm now in my third month of simulated trading, and was finally fortunate enough to get picked up by a prop house who is letting me do my practice trading using their facilities now.

My reflections are this is so much more difficult than IT its not even funny. I love it, but its grueling.

In IT, no matter how you perform, you get a paycheck at the end of the week.

In trading, not so. You keep what you kill so to speak, and if you end down, well, then your worse off than where you started.

And no matter how good you are, you will go through losing periods that make you question what you are doing.

After three months at this, I have not turned the corner towards profitability yet. You will likely go through this, and that makes you question your choice about trading even more.

Getting profitable means trading every day, and taking detailed notes as to what worked and what didnt and eventually developing a system or a set of discretionary trading setups that have positive expectation in the long run. This takes time, and if you are not training under someone who has figured out a trick to being profitable can take very long, and will be impossible for a lot of people who try. The months/years you spend doing this, you will have no income coming in.

In a "decent" IT job in the USA, you'll probably bring in $60,000-$120,000 / year depending on what you do. And good companies also will give you 5% of your salary into retirement, 401K matching, health care, and AD&D insurance.

Compare this to trading. If you trade prop, they will put you on sims first, then let you trade real money, but just enough size to cover your business expenses plus a little more(You might bring in the equivalent of $15,000-$20,000 USD annually on your learners stake). Then, once you earn the right to trade large enough to make some decent money, you'll probably be bringing in what you made in IT, but get NO BENEFITS.

This is IF you are one of the few who come around the corner and become profitable.

Of course, if you are consistently profitable, you can do much, much better for yourself than you could in IT. If you are independent, you will build your account and if you are prop, you will get authorization to trade larger and larger size.

So yes, the benefits are there, but just keep in mind what the heck you are getting yourself into.

I'd be lying if at least once a week, the thought "what have I gone and done ?!?!?" doesnt echo in my head as I sit on the sims not making money when I used to make a good living in IT.

To get to where I'm at, I had to quit my job, sell my house and eventually move in with family so that I could slash my expenses enough to give trading a real shot.

So, I do not mean to discourage. In fact I'm happier now in my job than I have been in any IT role I've been on. But I just wanted to give you some insights from someone who's done what you're trying.

Best of luck,

-T


Best of luck to you man. My prediction, however, is that one year from now you are gonna be banging your head against the wall and wailing why o why did you give up the IT career. I have heard this story play out many times.

There's no 'corner' of profitability to turn in trading. Traders who are making money love to think there is, of course. But traders massively underestimate the role of dumb random chance in trading results.

Out of all the stupid decisions, giving up a good job to trade full time (especially that commission hungry daytrading) has got to be near the top of the list. The fact that you 'love the markets' doesn't really change this much. (Drug addicts love shooting up too, but their passion for what they do doesn't prevent them from destroying themselves.)
 
Quote from spect8or:

Best of luck to you man. My prediction, however, is that one year from now you are gonna be banging your head against the wall and wailing why o why did you give up the IT career. I have heard this story play out many times.

There's no 'corner' of profitability to turn in trading. Traders who are making money love to think there is, of course. But traders massively underestimate the role of dumb random chance in trading results.

Out of all the stupid decisions, giving up a good job to trade full time (especially that commission hungry daytrading) has got to be near the top of the list. The fact that you 'love the markets' doesn't really change this much. (Drug addicts love shooting up too, but their passion for what they do doesn't prevent them from destroying themselves.)

Actually, you couldn't be more wrong spect8or ... and for the opposite of all the reasons that you just posted, too.

While spect8or may not have put the pieces of sucessful trading together, by reversing what he is saying, you [the reader] will have a few more additional clues to do so.

Best Regards,

Jimmy Jam
 
Quote from JimmyJam:

Actually, you couldn't be more wrong ... and for the opposite of all the reasons that you just posted, too.

Which reasons have I posted? That traders massively underestimate the role of chance in trading results is the only reason I can see that I posted. Do you deny that it's true? That if you asked 100 traders, who currently regard themselves as profitable, if their profitability is due to their skill or to luck that virtually every one of them wouldn't claim it was skill?
 
Quote from spect8or:

Which reasons have I posted? That traders massively underestimate the role of chance in trading results is the only reason I can see that I posted. Do you deny that it's true? That if you asked 100 traders, who currently regard themselves as profitable, if their profitability is due to their skill or to luck that virtually every one of them wouldn't claim it was skill?

No harm no foul bro.

But it is possible to succeed as an intra-day trader, and you have listed the reverse of just a few of the rules/principles/concepts required to do so.

Regards,

JJ
 
Quote from JimmyJam:

No harm no foul bro.

But it is possible to succeed as an intra-day trader, and you have listed the reverse of just a few of the rules/principles/concepts required to do so.

Regards,

JJ

Are you always so cryptic? I really have no idea of what you're talking about.
 
Quote from spect8or:

Which reasons have I posted? That traders massively underestimate the role of chance in trading results is the only reason I can see that I posted. Do you deny that it's true? That if you asked 100 traders, who currently regard themselves as profitable, if their profitability is due to their skill or to luck that virtually every one of them wouldn't claim it was skill?


The more I think about it, the more I think this statement is correct. Luck is a very big part of profitability. But if you really think about life in general--You could be doing all the right things and if "bad luck" is on your side you will fail. This being said, I rather be called lucky than skillfull any time.:)
 
Quote from bearnbull:

The more I think about it, the more I think this statement is correct. Luck is a very big part of profitability. But if you really think about life in general--You could be doing all the right things and if "bad luck" is on your side you will fail. This being said, I rather be called lucky than skillfull any time.:)

Of course random chance plays a role in life. (In fact, philosophically, you could (not that I do) plausibly argue that random chance decides everything.)

And yes, sometimes you can do 'everything' right and yet still fail. Even fail more miserably than someone who was apparently doing everything wrong. In trading, for example, anyone that has run 'Monte Carlo' simulations should be able to tell you that you it's possible to go broke trading even a great system (possible, though not very likely).

None of this justifies just sitting on your butt and doing nothing with your life, on the justification that if you are lucky, good things will happen to you regardless of what you do, of course. But an appreciation, I think, that chance sometimes plays an influential role can make us a little more humble. That's not a bad thing, is it?
 
Back
Top