If I trade ES and use 1 point stop loss, what are the pros and cons?

college_trad3r · May 1, 2009

Quote from Surdo:

Do you understand the difference between a STOP and averaging into a position?

I never said I employ a one point stop did I?

Please read what The OP asked, and answer it wiseass.

Now I know why I rarely participate in these threads.

Clearly you don't follow your own advice

powerfade · May 1, 2009

Quote from college_trad3r:

You can predict a position is a losing position if it goes one point against you?

You must be a PRO

A while back I suggested a correlation of the use of a backwards '3' in a screen name with incompetence. I felt the theory was pretty solid. The King of the imbeciles stock_trad3r, bondtrad3r and collegetrad3r were the ones that planted this seed in my mind. I felt the consistent content of their posts was too much to be explained away by coincidence.

I now feel there's another giveaway. Those who include this particular smiley in every post are almost certainly non-traders

It has to be this smiley. Just check it out, you'll see what I mean. T28 is the other reigning King of the Idiots.

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To the OP, it's very difficult to trade with a 4 tick stop on the ES. If the vol is there to justify the R/R (for you it's probably about 1/2.5, right?), you'll get stopped out on noise. If it's not, you won't have the range to cash out your winners.

R. Raskolnikov · May 1, 2009

You won't blow up but your account will suffer death by 1000 cuts. IOW, you won't succeed with this strategy. Anyone who COULD make it with this strategy is someone who has years of experience and is already profitable and is somehow trying to fine tune their trading.

Here is the best advice I can give you on the subject of ES trading....its far less about "timing" and far more about being right. If you are new, read this now and in 2 years, if you still remember this and are still around, you'll have a great appreciation for this advice.

Quote from BPtrader:

any opinions?

Thanks in advance.

the1 · May 1, 2009

No one can consistently time the ES within a one point margin of error. Any system that uses a 1 point stop is destined to fail. Those who do not understand the theory of randomness are destined to get ruined by it.

BPtrader · May 1, 2009

Quote from Surdo:

If you don't have a system, you will be "stopped out" all day long, trade less often with a wider stop and wider profit targets.

If you are using a one point stop, what is your target?

I have no target, only an exit rule. Unfortunately I cannot follow my own rule (that has been going on for a long time, I am tired of myself). That's why I resort to a stop loss.

the1 · May 1, 2009

Anyone who says this about trading is a seasoned trader. Very, very few understand that trading is NOT about timing the market. If a stop is your only method of managing risk you're done. Stops most certainly limit losses but they also gaurantee them.

Quote from R. Raskolnikov:

Here is the best advice I can give you on the subject of ES trading....its far less about "timing"

BPtrader · May 1, 2009

Quote from R. Raskolnikov:

You won't blow up but your account will suffer death by 1000 cuts. IOW, you won't succeed with this strategy. Anyone who COULD make it with this strategy is someone who has years of experience and is already profitable and is somehow trying to fine tune their trading.

Here is the best advice I can give you on the subject of ES trading....its far less about "timing" and far more about being right. If you are new, read this now and in 2 years, if you still remember this and are still around, you'll have a great appreciation for this advice.

I assume you are talking about a trend. I am thinking about a break. If the market is random, I wouldn't count on a trend, I will grab the break as it happens. I am thinking like this after looking at Red_Ink's blotters. I wish I had a chance of watching him trade, but I imagine that he gets out of a losing trade super-fast.

BPtrader · May 1, 2009

Quote from Fast_Trader:

Your entry would need to be precise; otherwise you could get stopped out on noise. If you're mainly trading breakouts/break-downs, a 4 tick stop could work. I use a 2 pt initial stop-loss on ES.

Thanks, fast_trader. I tried both 1 point and 2 point stop loss, I prefer donating $50 instead of $100 each time. It takes more profitable trades to cover a 2-point loss than a 1-point loss. Also, if the trade doesn't work initially, I need to get out. I have to force myself into accepting loss. I've never accepted loss before, believe it or not, I simply waited for the loser to come back. You know what happened sometimes=Huge Loss

dirkd · May 1, 2009

why dont u just use a .25 point stop? why give it a whole point?? Just don't bother trading the ES. May i recommend sim trading for at least 3 months. No Way anyone can trade the ES profitably with a 1 point stop loss. Sure i have surgical trades that hit my number on the dot but those are very few. Your better off not trading the ES.

dirkd · May 1, 2009

BP you don't have a stop loss problem, you have a discipline problem. Instead of worrying about your loss focus on getting in at a good point and then visualizing the trade and what will happen after you enter. Then if the chart deviates from your vision then you simply get out. However if you have a discipline problem nothing will help you. Everytime i have a discipline problem i think to myself, for example, I'm going to short the ES at 850 and from there it should go down but if it goes above 852 then im wrong and need to stop myself. I'll put in the hard stop at 852 and let the market do as it wants to. The stop is out of my hands and if im right my stop shouldnt be hit. if im wrong i've preselected a point at which i would know that i am wrong.