If edge is hard to get, why traders keep trading?

[bashatrader]

Quote from jem:

absolute bullshit.

I made a 6 figure living trading a highly leveraged account for over 5 years trading stocks off of t/a.

What is t/a? Do you mean TA (technical analysis?). Usual "/" is used for "or" or to denote a ratio. Anyway, what are the rules that changed? I'm new to trading.

 

[bashatrader]

Quote from intradaybill:

Expectancy is how much a trading sytem is expected (statistically) to win on average or the the "edge" (literally) of a system, in gambling terms. For a derivation of the formula see this excellent article by Michael Harris that relates expectancy to Kelly formula.

intradaybill thanks a lot. Excellent paper.

 

[TraDaToR]

Quote from risktaker:

If you have a solid edge, you don't need psychology stuff.

Psychology becomes an issue because you have no edge and your mind begins to question what you're doing as your confidence in your method erodes away.

If you have a solid edge/consistently profitable method, psychology rarely enters the realm. Unless, you're a really weak trader to begin with.

A trader with a great psychological frame of mind and no edge/losing method just confidently pisses away his entire account. Sort of like a perpetual casino gambler with a permanent smile.

No edge=loss of capital & need for psycho shit.
Good edge= money making machine & no need for psycho blab.

Foolish book authors who say...control your emotions, bla, bla, bla, don't realize that a trader who lack emotional control is someone with no edge. No matter how much 'control' he exerts on himself, he's just going to drain away his account in a controlled manner.

Ditto. Psycho is for Dr Elder...LOL.

 

[marketsurfer]

Quote from jem:

absolute bullshit.

I made a 6 figure living trading a highly leveraged account for over 5 years trading stocks off of t/a.

It worked great until they changed the rules.

In my office at one point in time 12 guys made a living doing the same.


we made 20 - 100 trades a day.

it was not statistically anomaly. It was an edge we had using t/a.

I am sure there are plenty of guys who still make a living using t/a.

the markets are very far from random.

TA or tape reading, seeing order flow, knowing the players??

can't think of any "rule changes" that effected the backwards looking TA.

 

[ProfLogic]

Quote from marketsurfer:

The VP of raytheon is about as relevant as the pope when it comes to markets. i don;t get the point.

i betcha you cant put me in touch with one REAL money manager who uses your methods succesfully for any length of time.

thanks, surf

thanks,
surf

Oh I could and even spent last week trading with his son but you are about as relevant to this industry as the pope as well so you wouldn't understand a word he tells you anyway. I can't help it if you aren't capable of verifying simple physics on your own.

 

[ProfLogic]

Quote from marketsurfer:

this makes no sense based on your other claims of perfect order, computers dont have emotions,

what is it?

surf

You are the expert or at least you act like one and don't agree that a majority of trading is psychological?? What's with you lately Dave, your prostate bothering you?

 

[ProfLogic]

Quote from jem:

absolute bullshit.
I made a 6 figure living trading a highly leveraged account for over 5 years trading stocks off of t/a.
It worked great until they changed the rules.
In my office at one point in time 12 guys made a living doing the same.
we made 20 - 100 trades a day.
it was not statistically anomaly. It was an edge we had using t/a.
I am sure there are plenty of guys who still make a living using t/a.
the markets are very far from random.

Shhhh . . . don't say this too loud. People will think you are crazy.
The closed minded "Ostrich" types that is.

 

[marketsurfer]

Quote from ProfLogic:

You are the expert or at least you act like one and don't agree that a majority of trading is psychological?? What's with you

i'm not an expert, still learning this fascinating game, however, i do know many people, at all levels, in the business. some of trading is psychological, i would say less than 10%, and that is having the confidence to trust your edge and take action in a dynamic chaotic environment-- regardless of proven edge. however, if you have real edge, psych has very little to do with it.

risk taker is 100% correct. psych is for the weak and those who don't posess an edge. however, there are exceptions, as you climb the ladder in assets--everyone has a limit of confidence--hence steve cohen consulting with psychologists---nothing to do with actual trading except for the nervous and weak who need a crutch and hand holding while they lose money.

surf

 

[Malstrom]

"If edge is hard to get, why traders keep trading?"
Because they think that in the future, after a lot of hard work, you get what you want.

answer this: "If getting a PhD from Harvard to become a very good doctor(or whatever) is hard to get, why people keep studying?"

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from dozu888:

people keep trading because most of them don't know that edges are hard to get..... the thread you quoted is a perfect example that 95% of the people on this site don't even have the basic knowledge about statistics, and they mistaken things like money management, risk control, discipline etc as an edge.

The fact that you don't recognize that risk/money management as the true edge in successful trading is a huge indication that you have a long long way to go in your learning and are fairly new to the game. Capital and the use thereof is the ONLY true edge in trading. Take it from someone who has many years of trading experience. Thank you for your time--Ishmael