I need career advice. Degree in Computer Enginerring?

Quote from nitro:


This is true, however, in my experience, this stuff is a help more for the less talented in the team than the extreme talent.

I worked for a software firm where there were a lot of superstars. I can tell you that not once did the super talent ever need any of this crap - they always had hundreds of thousands of code all in their head, in command at any time. Not only that, they understood the nuances of code that had to run on 8 different operating systems.

It is only when you meet someone so supremely skilled that you begin to realize that alot of "science/software engineering" is invented so that the meager talents can keep up.

nitro
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Depends upon the type of work you are doing .... Coders responsible for the binaries on 8 different OS ... yes they had better have the system in their head.

I guess we would define superstar a bit differently than you would ... Perhaps the distinction would be more between a superstar coder and a superstar engineer or product designer.

In our business you need to know quite a bit of mathematics: I dont know how you would be able to keep up or exceed the current work in the field without having the necessary training upon which to base your work - most of the current stuff is only accessible via relationships amongst a handful of workers which you wouldn't have unless you had the background ... this could be self taught or learned on the job but this would be exceedingly rare.
 
Sorry to disappoint, but yes I have a BS comp sci degree
and I hold a couple of technology patents to boot.
Why did I get the degree? I already explained. To get around
the short sighted managers in the corporate world.

But I consider the 4 years of college almost a complete
waste. Sure, I had to take a shit load of advanced
math classes, which is used in less than 1% of
comp sci jobs out there, but they are rarely useful.

Advanced CS stuff? Its pretty rare in the field too.
But ive done OS kernel work, ive written 3 production
computer languages (custom languages for unique purposes,
compiled and interpreted), tons of monster scalable systems
and distributed systems, and lots of architecture and design,
but refuse to completely give up on the coding.
Ive worked in most areas of comp sci, and ive coded
in at leat 12 computer languages.

I learned FAR more on my own than college ever taught me.
Then I learned 10 times as much in the field my first year
than 4 years of college.

I WOULD advise that everyone get their BS degree in
comp sci for political reasons. This will not guarantee that you
will learn much though. You can learn it all on your own if
you have the drive. I worked the unix help desks
in school and was the guy debugging all of the
students code. The MAJORITY had no business being
in comp sci. I used to fix their code just to get them
off of my back. Otherwise they just kept coming back
whining. Just more evidence that a degree is barely
worth the paper its written on.

But anything beyond that is a complete
waste of time. Your learning will accelerate at incredible
speeds once you enter the field and start cranking
on some REAL systems.

Ive also run my own successful consulting firm. Cashed
in nicely during the boom, then burned out living on
an airplane working all over the country. Now im enjoyng
the ride and just cruising as I learn to trade.

Computers are utterly boring and unchallenging now.
But I love trading, and its a challenge, so thats where
im going.

"As far as hiring you: no we would not be interested. "
This is hilarious. You actually seem to think I would be
interested in working for a bunch of snooty "theory" boys.
No thanks... I dont feel like schooling some thoery guys. :D
Started coding machine language when I was 10, and been
coding ever since. I seriously doubt you guys could challenge
me enough to make it interesting...yaaawn :D

So the moral of the story is, boys and girls... go to school,
get your BS, then go to work and really start learning.

Its just like trading... read all the books, then get to
work and REALLY learn how to trade.

Orrrrrrr.... go get your "PHD" in trading school, and then
start trading size immediately and watch yourself get KILLED.
LOL!

I dont need any "luck" CalTrader... not in my field.
I mastered computers years ago, and have a consistent
track record of kicking comp sci butt. Who needs luck when
you have a lifetime of skills? This is TOO easy. :D

peace

axeman



Quote from CalTrader:



So you do have a degree ? Why did you bother if it simply was not necessary to get a job, or of no use in your job ?

I dont know which "industry" you are talking about, but in the industry we work in, you get paid well by having a technique or tool that someboby else does not: read patents and the legal means to enforce it. I dont have any high schoolers listed on our patents: the work came out of years of research and hard work.

If you are talking about being a coder: yes we have many of these people on staff. They dont run the company though .....

I'm glad you have a job and work for a "super techie" and the others that run your firm. If your goal is to simply be employed than it sounds like you have accomplished that ...

As far as hiring you: no we would not be interested.

Best of luck to you.
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Quote from axeman:


I dont need any "luck" CalTrader... not in my field.
I mastered computers years ago, and have a consistent
track record of kicking comp sci butt. Who needs luck when
you have a lifetime of skills? This is TOO easy. :D

peace

axeman

More...

At our company all your experience would qualify you to do is wash the windows. Thats about it. The real experts already work for us.

Best of luck to you.
 
Could you be any MORE
close minded? Several experienced computer people
here have stated that some of the best comp sci guys
they know were NOT heavy into degrees.

Even Bill Gates is a college drop out, and im sure
he is far more successfull than anyone you know with
a degree!

Keep passing up people based on pedigree.
Go ahead... continue to handicap yourself.

In the meantime, i'll continue to IGNORE people's
pedigree and hire the guys WHO KNOW WHAT THEY
ARE DOING and have a proven track record, over
what a little piece of paper says.
I cant tell you how many PHD's ive rejected
in interviews. I could care less.

You on the other hand will continue to miss out
on these gems with no degrees.

Im sure you would choose a trader with 4 years
of "trade school" over a trader who learned on
his own and has been profitable for 4 years straight.

Yeah right.... your argument is so weak.
Pull your head out of the sand. A lack of a degree
means nothing when it comes to kick ass comp sci types
AND traders. It has far more to do with the individual
and the type of person he is.

College has NO monopoly on knowledge. Apparently,
you didn't learn this in school either.

My dad didn't make it past the fourth grade, and yet
he became a multi millionaire. How?
Because he LEARNED ON HIS OWN. What a concept, huh?

peace

axeman





Quote from CalTrader:



At our company all your experience would qualify you to do is wash the windows. Thats about it. The real experts already work for us.

Best of luck to you.
More...
 
Quote from CalTrader:



Depends upon the type of work you are doing .... Coders responsible for the binaries on 8 different OS ... yes they had better have the system in their head.

I guess we would define superstar a bit differently than you would ... Perhaps the distinction would be more between a superstar coder and a superstar engineer or product designer.

In our business you need to know quite a bit of mathematics: I dont know how you would be able to keep up or exceed the current work in the field without having the necessary training upon which to base your work - most of the current stuff is only accessible via relationships amongst a handful of workers which you wouldn't have unless you had the background ... this could be self taught or learned on the job but this would be exceedingly rare.
More...
I can tell you right now that I know half a dozen people, all without a degree from school, let alone a degree in CS, any of which could be the best programmer on your team. Some of them are _getting_ degrees, but many of them never bothered [and only one in CS, most are gettting degrees in Number Theory, Recombinant Biology, Physics, etc.]

I will say this though - Out of all of the people in the field that I know, I would venture to say that the ones WITH degrees are WAY better managers and way better orginized to run a project. As to be better designer than the programmers themselves - not a chance in some cases, yes in others.

nitro
 
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