I have bought Al Brooks' Trading Course

Frederick Foresight · Sep 10, 2015

k p said:
My PnL would prove that what I'm doing doesn't work. It doesn't mean my method doesn't work, but it might mean that my application of it doesn't work. As I said above, a PnL is the perfect aggregate of having a plan with a statistical edge along with the demonstrated ability to follow it.

Guys like marketsurfer believe TA is "fatally flawed" as a premise. Not just your specific application of TA or mine, but any TA. If the performance of the people such as those I mentioned earlier is not enough to shut him up, do you really think any P&L submitted for his "approval" here will change his mind? He just wants to sneak a peak. Feel free to show him yours if you want to...

marketsurfer · Sep 10, 2015

Frederick Foresight said:
Oh, so we have now entered the realm of...unsubstantiated claims...

Ok, whatever you say.

marketsurfer · Sep 10, 2015

k p said:
My PnL would prove that what I'm doing doesn't work. It doesn't mean my method doesn't work, but it might mean that my application of it doesn't work. As I said above, a PnL is the perfect aggregate of having a plan with a statistical edge along with the demonstrated ability to follow it.

Automation sounds like your solution if you are certain your method works.

Remember, PL can also be luck, good fortune, or simply being in a certain market at the right time for your method.

Surf

k p · Sep 10, 2015

Frederick Foresight said:
Guys like marketsurfer believes TA is "fatally flawed" as a premise. Not just your specific application of TA or mine, but any TA. If the performance of the people such as those I mentioned earlier is not enough to shut him up, do you really think any P&L submitted for his "approval" here will change his mind? He just wants to sneak a peak. Feel free to show him yours if you want to...

I think though that its a different thing to read a book about some guy who makes it work, and another to interact with a real person on a message board.

I also do think that in the face of consistent daily updates, MS would have to not blatantly avoid the evidence staring him in the face. The fact is, ever since I've been here for 2 years now, there is very little in terms of proof that isn't subjective. I simply cannot fault MS for being skeptical because I have yet to see any decent demonstration of consistent trading in real time, with real entries, for consistent profits. Yes I see lots of ideas throw around that look good and can be tested and tweaked, but nothing that is sufficient for a normal amount of skepticism that a person has to have these days when dealing with the WWW. This of course doesn't mean that MS is right about TA being ineffective, but the proof just isn't here.

Frederick Foresight · Sep 10, 2015

k p said:
I think though that its a different thing to read a book about some guy who makes it work, and another to interact with a real person on a message board.

I also do think that in the face of consistent daily updates, MS would have to not blatantly avoid the evidence staring him in the face. The fact is, ever since I've been here for 2 years now, there is very little in terms of proof that isn't subjective. I simply cannot fault MS for being skeptical because I have yet to see any decent demonstration of consistent trading in real time, with real entries, for consistent profits. Yes I see lots of ideas throw around that look good and can be tested and tweaked, but nothing that is sufficient for a normal amount of skepticism that a person has to have these days when dealing with the WWW. This of course doesn't mean that MS is right about TA being ineffective, but the proof just isn't here.

There are people who regularly posted their blotters in the P&L threads over the years. I was not among them. Some were very impressive; several said they used TA. Marketsurfer was here when those threads had traction. He remains "unconvinced" despite the number and the consistency. Perhaps if you were to acquaint yourself with those past threads going back several years you would see why anything presented to marketsurfer that he doesn't like, he "explains" away. Meanwhile he has yet to answer the simplest of questions I have asked him right here in this thread. Instead, he parries.

How would you candidly describe such a person? And why would you play into his hands?

marketsurfer said:
...Remember, PL can also be luck, good fortune, or simply being in a certain market at the right time for your method.

Surf

*Sigh*

marketsurfer · Sep 10, 2015

k p said:
I think though that its a different thing to read a book about some guy who makes it work, and another to interact with a real person on a message board.

I also do think that in the face of consistent daily updates, MS would have to not blatantly avoid the evidence staring him in the face. The fact is, ever since I've been here for 2 years now, there is very little in terms of proof that isn't subjective. I simply cannot fault MS for being skeptical because I have yet to see any decent demonstration of consistent trading in real time, with real entries, for consistent profits. Yes I see lots of ideas throw around that look good and can be tested and tweaked, but nothing that is sufficient for a normal amount of skepticism that a person has to have these days when dealing with the WWW. This of course doesn't mean that MS is right about TA being ineffective, but the proof just isn't here.

Thanks, I appreciate this post. I have been in the business 20 plus years and have never seen evidence of TA working except when combined with other methods then it money is made despite TA not because of it. surf

marketsurfer · Sep 10, 2015

Frederick Foresight said:
There are people who regularly posted their blotters in the P&L threads over the years. I was not among them. Some were very impressive; several said they used TA. Marketsurfer was here when those threads had traction. He remains "unconvinced" despite the number and the consistency. Perhaps if you were to acquaint yourself with those past threads going back several years you would see why anything presented to marketsurfer that he doesn't like, he "explains" away. Meanwhile he has yet to answer the simplest of questions I have asked him right here in this thread. Instead, he parries.

How would you candidly describe such a person? And why would you play into his hands?

Man, you really are a true believer-- a true fan of looking at the past to divine the future--- sorry that the truth destroys your hopes and dreams--- but thats the way it is.

Have you wondered what has happened to the P&L folks who were so consistent for a few months? Ok, there is your answer. surf

k p · Sep 10, 2015

Frederick Foresight said:
There are people who regularly posted their blotters in the P&L threads over the years. I was not among them. Some were very impressive; several said they used TA. Marketsurfer was here when those threads had traction. He remains "unconvinced" despite the number and the consistency. Perhaps if you were to acquaint yourself with those past threads going back several years you would see why anything presented to marketsurfer that he doesn't like, he "explains" away. Meanwhile he has yet to answer the simplest of questions I have asked him right here in this thread. Instead, he parries.

How would you candidly describe such a person? And why would you play into his hands.

I agree with you fully FF. I have looked into the past, and it seems like such a shame that I didn't start down this journey sooner as I think the environment was better.

And I am certainly not trying to play into his hands. I know he's wrong... I can see it with my own eyes. In just this past month, its amazing how much my eyes have opened to my version of TA. At this point, I know with certainty that the only reason I'm not killing it is because of me, but all I need is staring me right in the face, its right there on the chart and its simply a matter of putting on trades in the best possible places and letting the chips fall where they may.

But I still have to admit that right now... in this past year or two of being here at ET, I haven't seen anyone actually be able to do this in the same way that I could see a person pick up a recipe book, mix a bunch of ingredients together, stick it in the oven, and out pops a nice cake, just like the one pictured in the book that he was following.

There is of course no award for someone who figures this out and writes about it and shows how they do it, and there is perhaps even more reason to disappear into the shadows once you do figure it out, but the lack of evidence is unfortunate.

k p · Sep 10, 2015

marketsurfer said:
Man, you really are a true believer-- a true fan of looking at the past to divine the future--- sorry that the truth destroys your hopes and dreams--- but thats the way it is.

Have you wondered what has happened to the P&L folks who were so consistent for a few months? Ok, there is your answer. surf

See.. this is the problem surf. You suggesting that they blew up and hence why they no longer post is just a likely as that they just found something better to do with all their free time since they no longer worry about where their money will come from. Neither side here is offering anything compelling enough to actually make any solid deductions from.

k p · Sep 10, 2015

marketsurfer said:
except when combined with other methods then it money is made despite TA not because of it. surf

Well all we need now is Buy1Sell 2 to join this conversation about how all you need is money management since that is supposedly the only true edge and then we're set! LOL