I am buying 23 k worth of physical gold coins

with all this talk about canned tuna, i'd say the most valuable thing in armageddon would be a can-opener.

however, i wouldn't worry the collapse of all civilization. such an event is beyond reason; or if it happened, we'll be all dead (nuclear holocaust). who cares if you have 100k in gold.

what's more reasonable is the collapse of a single country, even the mighty usa. in that event, gold would retain its value.
 
Quote from bad feeling:

Ok ET time to prove your worth, I am buying over 20 k worth of gold because I would rather be a stupid man with gold than a smart ass with paper money.

Before I go to my bank and ask my advisor, what do you guys say

Where should I go to buy coins.

There is no way I am buying from some jewelry asses, they will price me up to 40% mark up

any thoughts are appreciated
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Bad Feeling

If you're that scarred of the future you'd probably be better off buying a automatic weapon and taking survival classes. During the last depression this country was more agrarian and the people were more self sufficient . There is over 300,000,000 people in this country today alot of them surviving on credit cards and welfare. Where are u gonna go when it really gets bad?? A few years back I purchased an island home off one of the coasts . Unfortunaltely, Theres not enuff of them big and hungry sharks to scare anyone off.................
 
Quote from sjfan:

I'm not sure I understand your logic here. If, tomorrow, civilization effectively ends for whatever reason, why would you (who, let's say, has the forsight to stock a few hundred cans of tuna) give me some tuna in exchange for gold coins?
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I think the problem is the idea that it's possible that 'civilization will end tomorrow'. I don't think you could convincingly describe a scenario in which 'civilization ends tomorrow'. Not even nuclear war involves that.

I don't think we have the same conception of what various doomsday scenarios would look like. If the US dollar was no longer being accepted within the continental U.S., things would obviously have progressed pretty far, but by no means does it imply that 'civilization would have ended'. In fact there would likely still be millions and millions of people around and that in itself would necessarily result in the exchange of goods. In my opinion, it is impossible that gold would suddenly cease to be a store of value, exchangeable for goods or services. Gold is money and there will always be a need for money in human business transactions.

However, difference of opinion is what makes a market. You obviously won't be buying gold if you live to see the day when the U.S. becomes economically unstable enough that the dollar is not accepted.
 
Newguy,

For those like me who do not live in the USA, it may still be worthwhile to hold physical gold in the event of the collapse of the US Dollar.

If and when the US Dollar price of gold goes up by a lot (eg. if an apple costs 100 USD, then maybe gold could be at 80,000 USD per ounce), then it is possible that the gold ETF and gold futures could trade at a substantial discount to the spot value.

One only needs to look at the open interest in gold futures to know that it would be difficult to find a sufficient supply of gold if all those holding gold futures wanted to take delivery.

Furthermore in your China example below from 1960, you did write that

Of course eventually the government recovered and gained control of the situation, and things became normal again. [/B]
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I infer from this that those who held gold during this time would still be holding the same gold after the turbulent period was over. Therefore I believe that in this situation, gold was a true store of value.


Quote from newguy05:

again you are missing the point, if it's just hyperinflation without the breakdown of the government, then dollar would still be accepted, yes it may cost $100 to buy an apple but paper dollar would still be the currency of the country. So you are talking about hedging against inflation using gold in a lockbox method once more.

If the dollar is not accepted in the USA, that means the ENTIRE economy/society has collapsed completely, so yes at that point it is very likely a mad max style future, maybe not as chaotic or violent but having gold/silver wont mean much either.

A much better example is during the cultural revolution in china around 1960, due to the government breakdown (in short, they let farm kids run the country for political maneuvers) where rampant starvation was common, the government was broken down. And guess what? noone cared about gold/silver, former rich landlords etc..would bring boxes of gold/diamond jewelry in exchange for some food and noone would take them.

So gold/silver were worth about as much as the useless currency.

Of course eventually the government recovered and gained control of the situation, and things became normal again.
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I second the comments from traderNik.

It is likely that my conception of a doomsday scenario differs from that of newguy.

Like traderNik, I can foresee a situation where the US Dollar collapses so much that it ceases to be a reliable 'medium of exchange', but not so bad that 'civilisation has ended'.

I agree with traderNik that in this type of situation, there would be plenty of people who would still be alive, who would likely want to use something (other than the US Dollar) as a medium of exchange.

Furthermore, if there was a social breakdown in the US, I am somewhat insulated from that as I live on a different continent.

There are plenty of examples of countries whose currencies have collapsed, yet there has not been a complete breakdown in society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation


Quote from traderNik:

I think the problem is the idea that it's possible that 'civilization will end tomorrow'. I don't think you could convincingly describe a scenario in which 'civilization ends tomorrow'. Not even nuclear war involves that.

I don't think we have the same conception of what various doomsday scenarios would look like. If the US dollar was no longer being accepted within the continental U.S., things would obviously have progressed pretty far, but by no means does it imply that 'civilization would have ended'. In fact there would likely still be millions and millions of people around and that in itself would necessarily result in the exchange of goods. In my opinion, it is impossible that gold would suddenly cease to be a store of value, exchangeable for goods or services. Gold is money and there will always be a need for money in human business transactions.

However, difference of opinion is what makes a market. You obviously won't be buying gold if you live to see the day when the U.S. becomes economically unstable enough that the dollar is not accepted.
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Quote from m22au:

I second the comments from traderNik.

It is likely that my conception of a doomsday scenario differs from that of newguy.

Like traderNik, I can foresee a situation where the US Dollar collapses so much that it ceases to be a reliable 'medium of exchange', but not so bad that 'civilisation has ended'.

I agree with traderNik that in this type of situation, there would be plenty of people who would still be alive, who would likely want to use something (other than the US Dollar) as a medium of exchange.

Furthermore, if there was a social breakdown in the US, I am somewhat insulated from that as I live on a different continent.

There are plenty of examples of countries whose currencies have collapsed, yet there has not been a complete breakdown in society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation
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currency collapse without civil unrest is more likely in countries that outlaw gun ownership or have military rule to start with.....

now if people begin to starve (happened in the US Great Depression), all bets are off............
 
If the dollar goes to pot (and it doesn't have to be nuclear holocaust pot, just continued long term fiscal horsehit pot + greedy bankers screwing everyone pot), I take my gold, move to Europe or some other place where the economy hasn't tanked and live there. Not sure why "gold tanks to $400" and "social order comes to an end and people are stabbing each other over cans of tuna" are the only options considered. Are we all 5 years old?
 
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