How to buy and sell more than 20,000 shares frequently?

Quote from vectors101:

market manipulation.

they make money on the commissions,fees and spread. and most important the brokers make money front running which is not illegal if the brokerage does it.
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Brokerages dont make money on spreads since they execute orders not take the other side of your trade. They dont front run either. Yes there have been cases in the past where thats happened but its pretty rare these days. Most of these retail brokerages you guys are talking about dont make markets in any products so they're not making money on spreads and if they front run its obvious. Besides with tens of thousands of customers trading through them how could they front run orders so quickly and choose what they want to front run? Not to mention if it ever got out they front run, with the ease in which you can switch firms they'd have a mass exodus.

Brokerages make money on commissions and interest on your money and fees thats the business model.


FRONT RUNNING IS NOT LEGAL
 
There is no standard for level II and as I mentioned earlier in this thread Level II was never meant to be the be all and end all of prices in the market, there is simply too much data and too many ECN's and exchanges. Level II was meant to give the retail trader more of a view of the market then simply the best bid and offer. yes its evolved over the years to more then it started as but again its not the entire universe of prices.

The speed of your level II depends a lot on your internet connection and the server which provides that data. There is always lag in different services and different vendors provide different portions of the entire universe of quotes.
 
Quote from plugger:

You should probably consult this old experienced trader you've previously mentioned. He should be able to point you in the right direction.

Question is, why didn't you do this at the start if you believe in what he says so much.
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The reason I posted my question here is to get other people's ideas on this.
 
Quote from Don Bright:

New York Open Book, for depth and where the real orders are.

Don
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I searched google and could not find NY Open Book. How do I access to it? Maybe from NYSE's web page?

Please advise.
 
Quote from xflat2186:

Brokerages dont make money on spreads since they execute orders not take the other side of your trade. They dont front run either. Yes there have been cases in the past where thats happened but its pretty rare these days. Most of these retail brokerages you guys are talking about dont make markets in any products so they're not making money on spreads and if they front run its obvious. Besides with tens of thousands of customers trading through them how could they front run orders so quickly and choose what they want to front run? Not to mention if it ever got out they front run, with the ease in which you can switch firms they'd have a mass exodus.

Brokerages make money on commissions and interest on your money and fees thats the business model.


FRONT RUNNING IS NOT LEGAL
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If what you are saying is true, howcome zecco.com with everything free with unlimited shares are free, can make money. They must be doing something illegal, don't they?

Can someone care to explain?
 
Quote from kapama:

If you are saying is true, howcome zecco.com with everything with unlimited shares are free, can make money.

Can someone care to explain?
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its simple PAYMENT for ORDER FLOW. They get a fee for seding your orders to specific desks. I dont know zecco off han but all these brokers have payment for order flow deals and soft money deals. If they are taking the other side of your trades they have to tell you they're in that business. Most regular retail brokers DONT do that, they're not in that business.
 
Quote from kapama:

I searched google and could not find NY Open Book. How do I access to it? Maybe from NYSE's web page?

Please advise.
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CVSonOctober32007.png


That's the depth of book shown our my Redi machine this morning. Much better disclosure than L2 IMO.

Just ask whoever you trade with for access to the NYOB, they should be able to help you.

Don
 
Quote from xflat2186:

Brokerages dont make money on spreads since they execute orders not take the other side of your trade. They dont front run either. Yes there have been cases in the past where thats happened but its pretty rare these days. Most of these retail brokerages you guys are talking about dont make markets in any products so they're not making money on spreads and if they front run its obvious. Besides with tens of thousands of customers trading through them how could they front run orders so quickly and choose what they want to front run? Not to mention if it ever got out they front run, with the ease in which you can switch firms they'd have a mass exodus.

Brokerages make money on commissions and interest on your money and fees thats the business model.


FRONT RUNNING IS NOT LEGAL
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Something to consider. Retail brokers give you cheap rates for MARKET orders, not LIMIT orders (for the most part). How often do you think they get buys and sells, at the market, on the same stocks? This is not front running, but they do make money on the spreads all the time in this circumstance. And, if they can't match trades, they often sell the order flow, just like they always have.

Don
 
okay they tell you straight up you only get 10 free trades a month and you have to keep a cash balance. Sounds like they know the price point and the number of trades point for most of their type clients and the interest they make on your balance and the payment they get in return for you order flow is enough to off set the 10 free trades. I would guess there are other qualifications too which help off set the handful of free trades per month but I didn't care to read it more closely since I am not interested in it. They also sell add space on their site and I am sure they sell other services too.
 
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