So not entirely a free choice then... Given the path you already walked and the knowledge you already have, would you rather be working a 9-5 job, or trading?
How did you start your trading journey?
- Thread starter toli
- Start date
So not entirely a free choice then... Given the path you already walked and the knowledge you already have, would you rather be working a 9-5 job, or trading?
9-5 all the way, with trading on the side as a part-time gig.
I have been struggling with day trading for my whole career, which started in 2014. I did GREAT in 2017 with day-trading CL futures, but I left that and came to equity indices in 2018. That is when my nightmare started...When Powell was chosen as chairman by Trump. Things were tolerable in 2018 though, and 2019 was a gift with the introduction of the equity micros at the CME.
2020 would have royally fucked me if I was still trading CL, because of the negative CL warnings. I would have been wiped out based on the old trading patterns I had. And that is the crux of it.
For my new swing-trading style, March 2020 and to late 2021 was fine, but 2022 threw a wrench in my plan, and so now I know that I cannot do anything other than day-trade, and it is still a difficult slog. I am a long-biased trader because of the environment I learned in.
I suppose you have the advantage of starting now, because you do not have that previous trauma of Trump tweets moving the Dow 1000 points in minutes, or circuit breakers firing when the US economy shuts down.
You can steel yourself for moves like that, which nobody here previously saw coming. Now I am just rambling. You will find your way. Just tread lightly, because Powell still exists. And now he has COVID, and he is old, so he may suffer from delusions and say stupid shit in two weeks.
Thank you for sharing! Very insightful to hear how it actually goes.
Please investigate the difference between the words "trading" and "investing". It might be that in your case investing might be a better choice than trading to achieve financial freedom.
Familiar with python? Others?
My story is very similar to yours except I'm probably a bit further down the line. So, I'll skip the preamble and just summarize key lessons I've learned thus far.
- It's not about the money per se, it's about the power and freedom financial independence will afford. You seem to realize this and so I'm being redundant. Still, it's worth keeping this top of mind.
- This is a serious and life-long endeavor. You need to understand that becoming successful in this field, like any other, will be an immense challenge and many fail. Be tenacious and avoid being flippant. Understand there is continuous improvement.
- There will be long periods of financial difficulty and massive sacrifices will be required to get through. In the very the end, it may not actually be worth it; c'est la vie.
- Read and study as much as you possibly can. You won't be able to "trade" independently without significant knowledge in many subjects; esp. investing, economics, psychology, technology, politics, mathematics, physics, homemaking etc.
- There's a huge difference between "greed' and "enlightened self-interest". The free market works for everyone because of the later, not the former. So, you absolutely must remember that, in a good trade, no one loses. I.E. It's not "zero-sum", so seek Pareto-dominated situations and opportunities.
- Don't spend too much time over-optimizing, this is greedy. Find solutions that are "satisfactory and sufficient"; so-called satisficing. As they say, perfection is the enemy of good enough.
- Unless you're doing accounting work, try to avoid thinking in absolute nominal terms... trading involves relative comparison.
- @Overnight makes a good point, you're going to lose money. However... it's better not to think of it as a loss. Your losses are being "paid forward", as a sort of tuition, salary, or insurance. Again, it's not zero-sum so there is no "loss" precisely.
- Avoid going bankrupt at all costs! Strive for stability and consistency. What you want to do is... recreate the security of a paid salary. You receive a consistent salary when working 9-5 so it is definitely possible to achieve that goal but for yourself instead. You just need to take on all the work that your co-workers were helping with before.
- It's like running any business. You're no longer just one cog in the machine though; you are the entire thing. Outsource if you have to, hire contractors and employees if necessary. But, remember you are "the boss" because mistakes will come directly out of your hide. You and your decisions matter immensely and greatly impact the results.
(T.N.T()--✹
Thank you for the insightful post!
This "not zero-sum" thingy is actually mind-blowing to me, as I cannot imagine how a trade can be "not zero-sum". This ethical consideration was actually one of the reasons I did not try it earlier.
Can you give an example how a trade can be not zero-sum? E.g. take forex: I buy USD for EUR because I think USD will go up and EUR will go down. But for that trade to happen, there needs to be a guy at the other end of the wire thinking the opposite - that EUR will go up and USD down. In this scenario, someone will lose for sure. Where is the growing pie here?
Can you elaborate please?
How do you pick stuff to learn? Do you follow your curiosity and learn whatever you feel like learning (past the mandatory fundamentals)? Do you have a reading plan you follow over the course of months?
I suppose "security" and "financial freedom" are two different things. How do the two relate in one strategy? How might such a strategy look like?
Interesting! I thought solo trading is one guy's job. What could possibly need outsourcing there? Accounting? Programming your custom strategy into a trading bot?
All great questions... I'll leave the answers as exercises for the reader 
You'll do well!
You'll do well!
All great questions... I'll leave the answers as exercises for the reader
You'll do well!
I feel in my heart of hearts that you can throw away Spy's idea that somehow, in your brain, "zero-sum" as a concept needs to exist. Who CARES if it is zero sum or not? Who CARES if you gain then someone else loses, and if you lose someone else gains?!?
Why does that matter in the equation of trading? All you care about is getting your profits by setting your stops and targets properly.
Do you KNOW the "person" you are trading against? Do you KNOW that the opposite side of the trade is getting a win or loss? The answer is no. Your exit may be someone else's entry!
But that is the physics behind the exchange. Don't worry about it, put it out of your mind!
Ug!
(Sorry, this was meant as a reply to @toli ) not you Spy, you zero-sum slacker!