Hey everyone, a little backround I'm a 21 year old aspiring day trader. I've successfully been paper trading equities for about a year, however since I don't have enough capital to actually day trade real equities, or have enough cash to put into a propshop, I've decided there may be a better future in futures lol. With more firms like topsteptrader coming around, the futures market seems to be good opportunity for someone that doesn't have a lot to start with. However my problem is that I don't know the first thing about trading futures. I know is that they are highly leveraged commodities, but when I look at a chart of futures and points it all seems so foreign. So basically I'm asking how did you get started? Where did you learn? Is there a college course I can take on trading futures? Any websites that allows you to paper trade futures? Most online courses come off as scams with ridiculous price tags. Please if you have any good info or advice is love to hear from you. Please don't respond with negative advice as I am very strong willed and have a strong passion for learning about the markets all I can. However please leave constructive criticism. Thank you all!
How did you learn to trade futures?
- Thread starter Joshjosh6969
- Start date
I don't think the solution to your problem is getting your hands on more leverage via futures. I would suggest getting a CFD account and trading very small, you'll learn more about the psychological game this way compared to demo trading.
As for learning how to trade futures there's a lot of noise out there. A good book to start with is 'Trading and Exchanges; Market Microstructure for Practitioners', it's a good starting point to frame how you approach markets. As far as learning a specific approach I'd recommend you look into 'auction market theory'. Lots of books out there and some good blogs and twitter profiles to follow (verniman's blogspot has some excellent curated links).
As for learning how to trade futures there's a lot of noise out there. A good book to start with is 'Trading and Exchanges; Market Microstructure for Practitioners', it's a good starting point to frame how you approach markets. As far as learning a specific approach I'd recommend you look into 'auction market theory'. Lots of books out there and some good blogs and twitter profiles to follow (verniman's blogspot has some excellent curated links).
Awesome I'll check those out for sure! Thanks for the reply.
the school of hard knocks
Not sure day trading is something to "aspire" to.
Do you have a career / degree path ? Do you have a decent day job ( don't quit your day job for trading ).
If you've worked / produced income, open a Roth IRA with a reasonable sized, initial contribution ( maybe a family member can help ). If you can do it before Friday, then you'll have a contribution towards 2015. Then, smaller contributions after that.
Think in terms of holding positions "longer term" ( years ). Investing in the U.S. equities market has given investors the best market environment and reward to risk of most any market over the last few decades and 1) the small cap value stock universe (via ETFs) has been shown to provide highest alpha premium of all stock universes * ( with the small / mid cap "growth" universe next ) 2) will compound asset growth within the Roth "tax deferred" framework and, and 3) for little effort, will most likely provide returns commensurate to "trading".
As for futures trading, a deep drawdown on an S&P / Nasdaq emini contract can equate to thousands of dollars. a $20K account equity would seem like a minimum amount if one is conservative, but below that, it would seem dicey. Good luck !
* https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kToqLWLISRk4n4YnSzv1hT5kBN54l5CvhwGgDwJKPJI/edit?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-_nQTfZG1aoIduZuvqCgJws3_ja_zHCuz4h6zLadUoo/edit?usp=sharing
James
Director, Quantitative research
XXX
Do you have a career / degree path ? Do you have a decent day job ( don't quit your day job for trading ).
If you've worked / produced income, open a Roth IRA with a reasonable sized, initial contribution ( maybe a family member can help ). If you can do it before Friday, then you'll have a contribution towards 2015. Then, smaller contributions after that.
Think in terms of holding positions "longer term" ( years ). Investing in the U.S. equities market has given investors the best market environment and reward to risk of most any market over the last few decades and 1) the small cap value stock universe (via ETFs) has been shown to provide highest alpha premium of all stock universes * ( with the small / mid cap "growth" universe next ) 2) will compound asset growth within the Roth "tax deferred" framework and, and 3) for little effort, will most likely provide returns commensurate to "trading".
As for futures trading, a deep drawdown on an S&P / Nasdaq emini contract can equate to thousands of dollars. a $20K account equity would seem like a minimum amount if one is conservative, but below that, it would seem dicey. Good luck !
* https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kToqLWLISRk4n4YnSzv1hT5kBN54l5CvhwGgDwJKPJI/edit?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-_nQTfZG1aoIduZuvqCgJws3_ja_zHCuz4h6zLadUoo/edit?usp=sharing
James
Director, Quantitative research
XXX
<<<How did you learn to trade futures?>>>
Losing an incredible amount of money every day in and out, once in awhile by some error the gods of trading would let me have enough to give me hope then stick it to myself again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, Visa and MasterCard were my favorite friends to buy food and gas so money I earned working would fund another account, all the destruction going on in my mind, all the computer parts made smaller, cat got deaf from me swearing at him, amazing he lasted 17.5 years.
But I stayed at it, it is the little moments of life that often make the biggest break thru, eventually got to breakeven and by end of year 7, I had recovered over $100k I had lost in taxable account. Only took 5 years to recoup long term Commodities.
Losing an incredible amount of money every day in and out, once in awhile by some error the gods of trading would let me have enough to give me hope then stick it to myself again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, Visa and MasterCard were my favorite friends to buy food and gas so money I earned working would fund another account, all the destruction going on in my mind, all the computer parts made smaller, cat got deaf from me swearing at him, amazing he lasted 17.5 years.
But I stayed at it, it is the little moments of life that often make the biggest break thru, eventually got to breakeven and by end of year 7, I had recovered over $100k I had lost in taxable account. Only took 5 years to recoup long term Commodities.
This is the truth, and basically its better to try to have a career after you graduate college.
If you can find a college class, that sounds good.
How did I learn to trade futures? I first took a couple classes and paid for a mentor. That really didn’t do it for me. The classes and mentor were competent, but I just didn’t fit into the way they taught. In hindsight I didn’t really understand how probabilities worked in the market with futures. I also didn’t understand how to deal with my fear/greed.
Every now and then people come along who apparently got off on the right foot trading and within months had a measure of success and went on from there.
On the other hand there is a recent thread here by Profitlocker who wonders why it took him 15 years to understand how the markets work. http://www.elitetrader.com/et/index.php?threads/why-does-it-take-so-long.299112/#post-4269664
If you can get the right idea(s) from the start, and find a fit with the amount of risk you need or tolerate – that does happen. But most of us need a job (or to be retired with some sort of income, or have family money) and work out trading over years of time.
All I can say is that I enjoy trading futures. I am in this, in no small part, for the journey – not just some reward at the end. It has required a development of depth in self-knowledge as well as in areas of math probabilities and finance. I’ve met some really great people. I wish you success.
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Real time actual trading is all that helps you beyond the first 2 or 3 days of chart reading and backtesting.
Hi
My opinion is don't use different kind of indicators which use all novice. That are not working. Try to other way. Try to start from volume profile and look at the volumetric analysis. Volumes on the market really signify big players.