Funny you should mention farmers in that message too. I just learned this week that you can trade Futures on the Weather!
How busy are you during the trading day?
- Thread starter lescor
- Start date
You made my point more succinctly than I did. I understand taking breaks. I even go to the bathroom once during the trading day. My point was that even if I am not trading every minute I am trying to learn, to prospect for new businesses and to make sure I don't miss out on the few opportunities that present themselves each day.
I agree too with the premise that your work environment needs to not be too tense or even enjoyable. I don't believe that I have some inalienable right to enjoy the work I do to put food on the table for my family. That sense of entitlement has just not reached me yet.
At opne point in my career, early on, I used to play hearts (before they had it on the computer) whenever it got slow. I rationalized it to myself that it was actually making me money because I wasn't getting into illiquid trades at lunch time. After much introspective thought, I realized that that thought process wasn't correct (for me at least).
The problem was getting into illiquid, ill advised trades during slow periods. The solution to avoid that was not playing games. That was not furthering my goal to be the best trader I could be. I needed to reach deep down inside and have the discipline and patience to be able to watch the markets without acting. That is the key to success. To do what is right AND to not do what is wrong. I was willing to put aside the short term satisfaction that comes from playing hearts and winning (video games these days are the equivalent distraction) and get my gratification on the back-end; that is, in the form of a CAREER as an independent trader and entrepreneur. I can come and go as I please. I do take off whenever I like. I can make it to all the basketball games I want to coach. Trading has afforded me quite the lifestyle. Short term gratification is great in the short run. Knowing I never have to get a job and suck up to a boss and work when he wants me to not when I want to because i can trade for a living is more reward than many of you know. It is not about the money. It is about the psychological gratification that trading provides in all facets of my life.
I agree too with the premise that your work environment needs to not be too tense or even enjoyable. I don't believe that I have some inalienable right to enjoy the work I do to put food on the table for my family. That sense of entitlement has just not reached me yet.
At opne point in my career, early on, I used to play hearts (before they had it on the computer) whenever it got slow. I rationalized it to myself that it was actually making me money because I wasn't getting into illiquid trades at lunch time. After much introspective thought, I realized that that thought process wasn't correct (for me at least).
The problem was getting into illiquid, ill advised trades during slow periods. The solution to avoid that was not playing games. That was not furthering my goal to be the best trader I could be. I needed to reach deep down inside and have the discipline and patience to be able to watch the markets without acting. That is the key to success. To do what is right AND to not do what is wrong. I was willing to put aside the short term satisfaction that comes from playing hearts and winning (video games these days are the equivalent distraction) and get my gratification on the back-end; that is, in the form of a CAREER as an independent trader and entrepreneur. I can come and go as I please. I do take off whenever I like. I can make it to all the basketball games I want to coach. Trading has afforded me quite the lifestyle. Short term gratification is great in the short run. Knowing I never have to get a job and suck up to a boss and work when he wants me to not when I want to because i can trade for a living is more reward than many of you know. It is not about the money. It is about the psychological gratification that trading provides in all facets of my life.
Huh? 
LOL!
Discipline,
I find that about three solid weeks of trading leaves me burned out and needing a break, whether I actually realize it or not. I wonder if you have the same experience? I trade at home alone and I also like to keep the distractions to a minimum. I just think the more that is going on, the harder it is to hear the market.
I find that about three solid weeks of trading leaves me burned out and needing a break, whether I actually realize it or not. I wonder if you have the same experience? I trade at home alone and I also like to keep the distractions to a minimum. I just think the more that is going on, the harder it is to hear the market.
Sometimes it is three weeks, sometimes less, and sometimes more when I need a break. When I break from the markets I make it a clean break -- no sneaking peaks at CNBC etc. I think about two times every three months I take a day or two off. I also take about 4 weeks full vacation a year. December and February when the kids have off and a two weeker at the end of August to get primed up for the fall's trading. Vacations are IMPORTANT! Distractions while trading are not.
took a look at your "peers trading" and my trading is much more simplier. basically, i look at the NDX for change in trend. as the trend change is CONFIRMED, then i look for 1 or more (currently i can handle only 1 at a time) stocks in this list for a breakout in that direction. its also gotta be sitting on top of the 34ema for the 1 and 5 minute charts, to reduce false breakouts (i found that the bounces off of the 34ema cause alot of stops for me, and commissions are killing me). so basically, i use the NDX as a signpost and then go to the bank with the cleanest, most highly probable setup -- which often appears in one of these stocks.
pretty damn easy...i've basically developed this out of a volitility breakout strategy, and then put a bunch of contraints on to increase the probability that the breakout won't immediately reverse on me before i'm able to scalp the initial move as a scaling out technique. this cuts down on my losses BIG TIME.
i had a problem (too many false breakouts thus high # of trades and commissions), backtested it with some simple contraints (moving averages), and implemented it on paper until i was happy with the changed results. as mentioned many times before, this is a very important characteristic of a trader if he/she wants to succeed in the long run.
Maybe a bit off topic, but a quick story. A long, long time ago, in a far away place (Boulder, Co., 1988) I had a client...very young guy, who worked for NCAR (National Center for Atmospheric Research). He was very tuned into the global weather patterns. He used his info to trade Orange Juice futures (a big pain fo me at the time...had to get my series 3 and be at my office even earlier). He batted almost 1000 in his initial trades. But he never took a profit. He just bought more contracts with his unrealized profits (as commodities traders tend to do).
He never came out with a profit. He didn't lose either, which was good. I wonder what happened to him. All he needed was one home run. I bet he got it too. But the point is, weather is a MAJOR factor when trading most most futures. I don't know how much, if at all, the weather affects metals and financials, but crops and livestock are hugely affected by weather. Most people don't realize the difference between speculative futures traders, and bona fide hedge traders. Different rules completely. Very interesting stuff. The guy you see driving a tractor when you are cruising down the interstate may be the biggest commodities trader you ever laid eyes on, with his straw hat, his overalls, and his sweaty red neck. He isn't Mortimer from Trading Places. But he may be a bigger player.
Again, as I always say....study the series 3 material if you want a grasp on futures. It will help with ALL aspects of trading. And it will make options much more understandable as far as assignments and exercises. You can never know too much!
Peace,
rs8.5I absolutely see your point. However, I feel that right now I am not good enough to try to trade during lunch period and particularly lately the afternoon periods. While I can make myself sit through and trade much much less, I feel that it makes the overall day more stressful. There is already enough stress in trading and more can only hurt you and your profits.
There is money to be made at all times, without a doubt. Once I get more experienced I will put start trading during the bad time periods much more. Even now, I do not play games the entire 2 hours. It's more like 20 minutes here, 10 minutes there.
In P&L terms, it has helped me so far. With time, I plan to change that situation. But right now, the risk and reward ratios tell me otherwise.
Thanks for the advice.
You must be kidding. Here in Hawaii the market is closed at 9:30 in the morning. During the day. I take the convertible for a Drive or go to the Beach!
Trading Seasonl Spreads EOD lets me sleep at night.
Trading Seasonl Spreads EOD lets me sleep at night.