HFT is Killing the EMini

Quote from CrackPipe:



as for spoof orders, thats a null argument. if the order is in the book you can hit it.
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That is not true.

NASDAQ allows orders to be pulled AT THE SAME DECIMAL PRICE THAT YOU ARE TRYING TO HIT.

Example- NASDAQ book is showing 5 individual orders at 50.01 bid for a total of 10,000 shares.

Here is the order on the book-

100
100
100
700
9000

I send my sell order to Nasdaq for 10,000 shares at 50.01. I will get filled from the first couple of 100 share bids and maybe the 700 bid (probably not though), but there is ZERO chance that I will get the 9000 share bid unless it was a legitimate resting order (meaning NOT A HFT BID).

Nasdaq's system allows the fastest HFT algo's to pull without giving you a fill even though you were entitled to those shares. Their entire system is a pathetic joke and the farthest thing from a fair market.

This is not something new, Nasdaq has been allowing this for years (which is why I try to use EDGX and ARCA) instead of that scumbag nasdaq system.
 
Quote from Clubber Lang:

That is not true.

NASDAQ allows orders to be pulled AT THE SAME DECIMAL PRICE THAT YOU ARE TRYING TO HIT.

Example- NASDAQ book is showing 5 individual orders at 50.01 bid for a total of 10,000 shares.

Here is the order on the book-

100
100
100
700
9000

I send my sell order to Nasdaq for 10,000 shares at 50.01. I will get filled from the first couple of 100 share bids and maybe the 700 bid (probably not though), but there is ZERO chance that I will get the 9000 share bid unless it was a legitimate resting order (meaning NOT A HFT BID).

Nasdaq's system allows the fastest HFT algo's to pull without giving you a fill even though you were entitled to those shares. Their entire system is a pathetic joke and the farthest thing from a fair market.

This is not something new, Nasdaq has been allowing this for years (which is why I try to use EDGX and ARCA) instead of that scumbag nasdaq system.
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nonsense
 
Quote from dumb_mother:

nonsense
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$10,000 cash bet (let Baron hold the cash) that everything I wrote is true.

Nasdaq allows orders to be pulled AT THE SAME DECIMAL LEVEL that incoming orders should hit. It's been that way for years.

Buck up your 10k piker. Actually shocked that people don't know this. The depth of book on NAZ is the biggest spoof going. After the first 2 or 3 levels, algo's can pull without filling.
 
Quote from PocketChange:

If you have a beef it should be with the Exchange and not anyone class of market participants.

The game is getting progressively faster because Globex can order match and post trades faster. A few years back it was 25ms than 14ms and now under 1ms.

What difference does it really make as long as the game is fair and everyone participating has equal access?

Level II DOM has expanded from 5 to 10 levels per side and the exchange provides protection on all orders from ridiculous fills. If you get filled outside of the bust range the order will be cancelled.
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Could you please point to Globex documentation stating that trade speeds are now under 1 ms.

All the CME documentation I can find for 2011 still shows a Globex trade speed of 5 to 7 ms.
 
Quote from dumb_mother:

nonsense
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ok then..but i'm with Clubber Lang..trade more with decent size and you will run into this issue sooner than later. i'm having such fun every single day.
as you can see it's starts with stocks long time ago. it was more noticeable on low volume stocks,less on more liquid ones, but now even futures traders note the impact of HFT..have fun with it, all HFT defenders..soon you will be in same shoes, just like stock traders..unable to buy couple contracts at the ask,even when 10 was displayed.
 
The only few people who defend HFTs have vested interest in doing so.

Objectively speaking, it is not trading... it is vampire leaching from order flow and true open interest. Algos do not create liquidity, they drain true liquidity.

To the people who admonish others about adapting: surviving traders have already adapted to the HFT/algo world. They adapted by trading smaller size and more round turns to combat the incessant counter-swing bursts and random spikes & slams that exist only because some bot is spreading futures against shares in liquidity-drain fashion.

Remember all the guys back in 2008 who gloated about $100k days and seven-figure profits? Where are all those big gains now? Same guys are still in the game... but they cannot work same size as three years ago. The tapes are much more erratic because of the illiquidity.

It's not that anyone cannot fill 100-lot ES... the fact is, who the hell wants to? The next real flash-crash will happen again, it'll happen soon and this time it will not recover intraday. When the next algo-driven crash hits this current market, it will finish the day off -1,000 index points on the Dow.

HFT is nothing but another temporary fad in the market. It ain't trading, it's just loopholed order flow theft and nothing more. HFT guys don't know the first thing about real trading, any more than SOES bandits did.

Same game, different era, same inevitable end.
 
Quote from rosy2:

do you have anything besides themis? you do know they are regarded as a joke?
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like i said in some other thread-i have 10+ years of daytrading experience. at least 50+ transactions each day. sometimes -hundreds of them. and off course i have my own observations. i have exactly same experience like these themis guys describe. there is plenty of ET members, who ACTUALLY DO TRADE having similar problems with HFT.
i have no problems with MAESTRO approach,but i do have problem with fake orders,subpenny trades,orders with no intention to buy or sell anything.
 
Quote from Bob111:

like i said in some other thread-i have 10+ years of daytrading experience. at least 50+ transactions each day. sometimes -hundreds of them.
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лжешь собака!аз есмь царь!!!

:D :D :D
 
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