You're right.
Both of you fit the category of "jealous loser".
Hedge Funds
- Thread starter FXsKaLpEr
- Start date
You're right.
Both of you fit the category of "jealous loser".
ooohh! The big bad hedge fund guys are going to cheat and steal from us poor defenseless millionaires who are <b>too freakin' lazy</b> to do the proper due diligence on the people we entrust our money to. We NEED the helpful hand of government to step in and protect us!
God. You'd think people would realize that the federal government is already a bloated waste-machine...but no!
Clowns like this journalist feel the government <b>isn't big enough yet.</b>
Actually those are moving lower as there are so many HFs competing for the same investor dollars. There are also getting to be some mutual fund alternatives to long/short equity hedge funds, further reducing costs for investors. A lot of funds are starting to do 1/20 and I would suspect that the 20 will come down as well in the future except at the very top of the industry.
Is it just me or does it seem that there are more HF frauds in the US then in Europe even though there is less regulation in Europe?
RM, give it a few more years. By then, these losers will be clamoring for guillotines in Times Square.
thanks, so far, for the input, guys, aside from the insults of scared men who love doing the trader shuffle and who hate change because it scares them because they are losers.
I guess we need to make a further division so this increase in pay can be more clearly defined.
two groups of managers/traders (MTs) exist in the industry:
Competent Trader (CT)
Rookie Trader (RT)
as I have pointed out before, 95% of traders lose. that number doesn't go away just because someone decides to open a hedge fund and run public money.
and when losses hit (for example) they can turn a $400m fund into a $180m fund, as per this article.
therefore, let's focus the MT pay raise / pig-rich investor decrease in pay as it applies to CTs only, as there will always be amateurs in every industry and those who use their mediocre services to try to save some money: But those are not the ones who set the standards.
we need to distinguish between the two classifications because of this reason: It is never enough for the rich investors: They don't care about anything but themselves and how they can exploit the poor to get themselves richer.
as long as they keep inching forward more and more, demanding lower and lower pay for MTs where will it stop?
I'll tell you where.
You ever drove over to a Home Depot at 6:30AM and seen the guys from Mexico and south of the border standing outside?
The pig-rich do nothings will start using these guys to trade their money for $7/hr.
Then they will use their Spanish house cleaners:
Pig-rich investor: "Maria, come over here. That's right, stop scrubbing the toilet and come here, I want to show you something...."
Maria: "Si, Senior."
Pig-rich investor: "Now, how much do I pay you a week to work and live here, Maria?"
Maria: "$125 ah wehk, Meester Jones."
Pig-rich investor: [winces] "Fine, fine *cough* ... now here's what I want you to do. See the different stocks listed on this screen?"
Maria:"Ehh??"
Pig-rich investor: "That's right, now just take this mouse and click that Trade Execution screen when you think you should open a trade. Then when you think you need to close it, click Close. You'll get the hang of it."
Maria: [sits down] "OK, Senior."
Pig-rich investor: "I'll be at the club if you need anything, just call."
Maria: "Si, Meester Jones."
Pig-rich investor: "Oh, and Maria, try to scrub the floors in between trades."
There you have it.
Anyone wants to go the way of the pig-rich investors, fine, it's up to you.
But MY definition of minimal Level of Competency (LOC) starts by effectively and consistently being able to access and trade the forex cash market.
All others can keep their pay rates as low as they want and produce their fledgling meager returns or losses.
The pig-rich investors will NEVER access MY trading talents for under 4/40. Plus, after the target goal of 25% (for the 2-year lock-up period) is hit, they get CAPPED at 25%. I get ALL the rest for MY pay.
If they don't like it, let them hire their new money runners from in front of Home Depot.
sKaLpZ
I guess we need to make a further division so this increase in pay can be more clearly defined.
two groups of managers/traders (MTs) exist in the industry:
Competent Trader (CT)
Rookie Trader (RT)
as I have pointed out before, 95% of traders lose. that number doesn't go away just because someone decides to open a hedge fund and run public money.
and when losses hit (for example) they can turn a $400m fund into a $180m fund, as per this article.
therefore, let's focus the MT pay raise / pig-rich investor decrease in pay as it applies to CTs only, as there will always be amateurs in every industry and those who use their mediocre services to try to save some money: But those are not the ones who set the standards.
we need to distinguish between the two classifications because of this reason: It is never enough for the rich investors: They don't care about anything but themselves and how they can exploit the poor to get themselves richer.
as long as they keep inching forward more and more, demanding lower and lower pay for MTs where will it stop?
I'll tell you where.
You ever drove over to a Home Depot at 6:30AM and seen the guys from Mexico and south of the border standing outside?
The pig-rich do nothings will start using these guys to trade their money for $7/hr.
Then they will use their Spanish house cleaners:
Pig-rich investor: "Maria, come over here. That's right, stop scrubbing the toilet and come here, I want to show you something...."
Maria: "Si, Senior."
Pig-rich investor: "Now, how much do I pay you a week to work and live here, Maria?"
Maria: "$125 ah wehk, Meester Jones."
Pig-rich investor: [winces] "Fine, fine *cough* ... now here's what I want you to do. See the different stocks listed on this screen?"
Maria:"Ehh??"
Pig-rich investor: "That's right, now just take this mouse and click that Trade Execution screen when you think you should open a trade. Then when you think you need to close it, click Close. You'll get the hang of it."
Maria: [sits down] "OK, Senior."
Pig-rich investor: "I'll be at the club if you need anything, just call."
Maria: "Si, Meester Jones."
Pig-rich investor: "Oh, and Maria, try to scrub the floors in between trades."
There you have it.
Anyone wants to go the way of the pig-rich investors, fine, it's up to you.
But MY definition of minimal Level of Competency (LOC) starts by effectively and consistently being able to access and trade the forex cash market.
All others can keep their pay rates as low as they want and produce their fledgling meager returns or losses.
The pig-rich investors will NEVER access MY trading talents for under 4/40. Plus, after the target goal of 25% (for the 2-year lock-up period) is hit, they get CAPPED at 25%. I get ALL the rest for MY pay.
If they don't like it, let them hire their new money runners from in front of Home Depot.
sKaLpZ
It is already happening, a lot of the institutional investors (pension funds, endowments, etc) already negotiate for a lower management fee, I have seen 0.5 / 10 quite a few times over the last year or so on large allocations (usually $100M+).
Now, I know I am with the minority of hedge fund industry here, but bear with me.
I have been on both sides, with a few hedge funds and one fairly big prime broker. It is very easy to commit hedge fund fraud, it is substantially easier for a hedge fund to fake a set of results than a mutual fund, or even a REIT, and that's the troubling part. It is generally impossible to extract good information from the fund unless you are a significant investor (i.e., an institution, rather than a poor high-net-worth person investing the minimum of $250k), or have some personal relationship. If a HNW doesn't have access to the proper channels, they would have to trust the offering memorandum at face value, and that's quite dangerous.
Now, I am not certain that more HF regulation will make the industry more transparent. If anything, this will just push up the HF legal fees in generating more intermediate entities to avoid outright disclosure (i.e., much more complex than your standard master-feeder structure). Which is why myself, and I would advice anybody that listens, to avoid small hedge funds of <$50M, or at least try to get a personal referral to the fund (to get more "color" from the fund managers), regardless of the claimed return level.