last traded in 2002, correct. although the order execution process has changed for sure, technicals/candlestick patterns/behavioral psychology of institutions has been and always will be the same. I don't scalp bid-to-offer to make a few pennies. I find a sector and/or a few stocks that are working, and go with it.
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hedge fund trader vs. daytrader
- Thread starter flybynight
- Start date
I think you will find it very difficult to get hired, as your returns are not something truly mind-boggling, nor are they current enough (2002, right?). I suggest building a track record under current market conditions and then presenting your case.
"last traded in 2002, correct. although the order execution process has changed for sure, technicals/candlestick patterns/behavioral psychology of institutions has been and always will be the same. I don't scalp bid-to-offer to make a few pennies. I find a sector and/or a few stocks that are working, and go with it."
Ill be brutaly honest and tell you the truth. There is not a snowballs chance in hell that you will get a job with a decent sal. and huge bonus potential if you havent traded in 4 years. YOu will need to put up your own cash or work on a very tight stop with a minimal draw for 6 months.
The market dynamics and automation have changed dramaticaly from just 12 months ago lets alone 48 months. I wish you the best but the reality is it is not going to happen.
Ill be brutaly honest and tell you the truth. There is not a snowballs chance in hell that you will get a job with a decent sal. and huge bonus potential if you havent traded in 4 years. YOu will need to put up your own cash or work on a very tight stop with a minimal draw for 6 months.
The market dynamics and automation have changed dramaticaly from just 12 months ago lets alone 48 months. I wish you the best but the reality is it is not going to happen.
i agree with the last statement....certain guys with us who used to consistantly print good coin 10k plus per month have seen their monthly P n L dip a lot ...trading the same stocks they traded for years
aut0mmation has definatly taeken a bite out of hte super scalper sectore traders
and come hybrid...forget it...gonna be VERY VERY competative
aut0mmation has definatly taeken a bite out of hte super scalper sectore traders
and come hybrid...forget it...gonna be VERY VERY competative
Where are the career opportunities for NON day traders?
Quote from flybynight:
last traded in 2002, correct. although the order execution process has changed for sure, technicals/candlestick patterns/behavioral psychology of institutions has been and always will be the same. I don't scalp bid-to-offer to make a few pennies. I find a sector and/or a few stocks that are working, and go with it.
Why have'nt you traded the last 4 years?
<i>"I agree that someone who just "daytrades" is going to have a serious problem, no matter what. The "day of the daytrader" has been long over."</i>
That may be true for stock traders... a tough racket I wouldn't care to stake my financial future upon. Not true at all for futures traders, especially eminis.
While trading is considerably more difficult than years past, successful trading emini futures demands true trading skills. None of the order-flow b.s. payments or trading inside bid/ask spread... no reading specialists while depending on their human tendencies to manage stock inventory books.
That stuff has zero to do with true trading skills. Anyone who ever thought SOES bandit garbage or pay-for-flow tactics would/will last forever are kidding themselves. Temporary disparities in a market that will purge them out via self-survival.
A lot of high-income earning market participants (not traders) built their fiscal foundation on a bed of shifting sand. Winds blow, foundations on sand crumble.
*
Any skilled trader can make a living right from the comfort of their own home. As for the $$ leverage advantages with prop shops, I see none for emini traders. A skilled trader can either earn their own bankroll thru organic growth or manage other people's money for 25% profits all day & night.
Key words being <b>"skilled trader"</b>. A lot of prop shop market players are not skilled traders... i.e. able to trade the correct side of rising or declining tapes based on pure price analysis alone.
<b>FlyBy,</b> develop that skill in the emini futures, you can earn a king's ransom yearly. Start with one contract and build your way to two. If you have the trader skills to produce 40% annual in stocks (albeit entirely different market conditions than today) you will be just fine.
<b>Don, </b> I have the utmost respect for you and your opinions. But... you are wrong about the day of daytrading being over with. I read somewhere your brother pushes 1,000s of eminis turned per session in scalp fashion. That's one way to skin the proverbial cat. Good emini traders can average +1% of account balance returns <b>per day</b> on average... over the course of time. That includes normal losing days and likewise the +4% of account balance days, combined.
Prop trading is viable, but by no means the only path to success. A lot of us private guys are sitting home, where we prefer to be, using a lot less leverage than the stock players while racking up methodical gains month over month.
We'll do that until we decide otherwise, because the market itself dictates nothing to us. True trading skills of navigating the tape can never be rescinded, once earned.
Best Trading Wishes
That may be true for stock traders... a tough racket I wouldn't care to stake my financial future upon. Not true at all for futures traders, especially eminis.
While trading is considerably more difficult than years past, successful trading emini futures demands true trading skills. None of the order-flow b.s. payments or trading inside bid/ask spread... no reading specialists while depending on their human tendencies to manage stock inventory books.
That stuff has zero to do with true trading skills. Anyone who ever thought SOES bandit garbage or pay-for-flow tactics would/will last forever are kidding themselves. Temporary disparities in a market that will purge them out via self-survival.
A lot of high-income earning market participants (not traders) built their fiscal foundation on a bed of shifting sand. Winds blow, foundations on sand crumble.
*
Any skilled trader can make a living right from the comfort of their own home. As for the $$ leverage advantages with prop shops, I see none for emini traders. A skilled trader can either earn their own bankroll thru organic growth or manage other people's money for 25% profits all day & night.
Key words being <b>"skilled trader"</b>. A lot of prop shop market players are not skilled traders... i.e. able to trade the correct side of rising or declining tapes based on pure price analysis alone.
<b>FlyBy,</b> develop that skill in the emini futures, you can earn a king's ransom yearly. Start with one contract and build your way to two. If you have the trader skills to produce 40% annual in stocks (albeit entirely different market conditions than today) you will be just fine.
<b>Don, </b> I have the utmost respect for you and your opinions. But... you are wrong about the day of daytrading being over with. I read somewhere your brother pushes 1,000s of eminis turned per session in scalp fashion. That's one way to skin the proverbial cat. Good emini traders can average +1% of account balance returns <b>per day</b> on average... over the course of time. That includes normal losing days and likewise the +4% of account balance days, combined.
Prop trading is viable, but by no means the only path to success. A lot of us private guys are sitting home, where we prefer to be, using a lot less leverage than the stock players while racking up methodical gains month over month.
We'll do that until we decide otherwise, because the market itself dictates nothing to us. True trading skills of navigating the tape can never be rescinded, once earned.
Best Trading Wishes
Quote from MadBulgarian:
Why have'nt you traded the last 4 years?
I've stayed off this post for a bit for fear I was appearing to "Pro-prop" vs. the hedge fund manager/trader. Didn't want to upset anyone.
That being said, I find it interesting that so many knowledgeable people still think the most traders "day-trade". If our traders only daytraded, they would likely fade away (as have many day traders over the years at other firms, and even ours).
Our traders try to stay ahead of the game, trade pairs and mergers, manage their own (sometimes large) portfolio's, etc. Sure, at times they may enter and exit the same day, but sometimes they wait months...keep dozens if not hundreds of open positions for days/weeks/months.
FWIW,
Don
btw, what is the minimum amount of capital needed for a HF?