Heaven is a fairy tale, says physicist Hawking

Quote from jem:

Caught Hitchens on 60 Minutes the other week ...

he left open the possible existence of God, saying something to the effect of "Never say never."

ardent atheists are idiots ... there are obviously valid criticisms of religion, but to insist "God" doesn't exist, is just stupid
...who needs to insist "God" doesn't exist when there is no evidence of, or necessity for a universe to need one ?

What's "God" supposed to be anyway?

And because you can't properly establish a "God", doesn't then mean everyone else has to establish there isn't one.

On the possible existence of the Tooth Fairy.... never say never .
 
Quote from dcvtss:

Have you read Hawking's book? It's premise is a direct argument against our universe being "special" based on recent developments in theoretical physics, more recent than many of these quotes.

How can we understand the world in which we find ourselves? Over twenty years ago I wrote A Brief History of Time, to try to explain where the universe came from, and where it is going. But that book left some important questions unanswered. Why is there a universe--why is there something rather than nothing? Why do we exist? Why are the laws of nature what they are? Did the universe need a designer and creator?

It was Einstein’s dream to discover the grand design of the universe, a single theory that explains everything. However, physicists in Einstein’s day hadn’t made enough progress in understanding the forces of nature for that to be a realistic goal. And by the time I had begun writing A Brief History of Time, there were still several key advances that had not yet been made that would prevent us from fulfilling Einstein’s dream. But in recent years the development of M-theory, the top-down approach to cosmology, and new observations such as those made by satellites like NASA’s COBE and WMAP, have brought us closer than ever to that single theory, and to being able to answer those deepest of questions. And so Leonard Mlodinow and I set out to write a sequel to A Brief History of Time to attempt to answer the Ultimate Question of Life, the Universe and Everything. The result is The Grand Design, the product of our four-year effort.

In The Grand Design we explain why, according to quantum theory, the cosmos does not have just a single existence, or history, but rather that every possible history of the universe exists simultaneously. We question the conventional concept of reality, posing instead a "model-dependent" theory of reality. We discuss how the laws of our particular universe are extraordinarily finely tuned so as to allow for our existence, and show why quantum theory predicts the multiverse--the idea that ours is just one of many universes that appeared spontaneously out of nothing, each with different laws of nature. And we assess M-Theory, an explanation of the laws governing the multiverse, and the only viable candidate for a complete "theory of everything." As we promise in our opening chapter, unlike the answer to the Ultimate Question of Life given in the Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, the answer we provide in The Grand Design is not, simply, "42."

Excellent quote and thank you for engaging in serious discussing.
In your last paragraph you nailed it.

Our universe looks -- see quote above "extraordinarily fine tuned".
That is evidence of a creator.

However, Hawking goes on to explain that theoretical physics allows (this is very speculative and there is no proof) there could be almost infinite other universes.

--

So that is the point... of where many scientists are right now.

You can observe the extraordinary fine tunings in our universe...
leading a person with a brain to realize... those fine tunings need a tuner... in absence of new findings.

or

you can BELIEVE there are trillions and trillions of other so far unobserved universes... where anything can and has happened.

leading to the statement...

evidence of God or the necessity of unicorns but not neither.
 
Hawking is in the book selling business. So, it is a safe bet that his book advertized as "The Answer" can't really deliver it.
 
Quote from jem:

Excellent quote and thank you for engaging in serious discussing.
In your last paragraph you nailed it.

Our universe looks -- see quote above "extraordinarily fine tuned".
That is evidence of a creator.

However, Hawking goes on to explain that theoretical physics allows (this is very speculative and there is no proof) there could be almost infinite other universes.

--

So that is the point... of where many scientists are right now.

You can observe the extraordinary fine tunings in our universe...
leading a person with a brain to realize... those fine tunings need a tuner... in absence of new findings.

or

you can BELIEVE there are trillions and trillions of other so far unobserved universes... where anything can and has happened.

leading to the statement...

evidence of God or the necessity of unicorns but not neither.

"Throughout history, God has been shrinking. The time when the world was small and God was in control is always in the far distant, half-remembered past. The closer we approach to the present, the less common miracles are and the less accessible he becomes, until the present day when divine activity has dwindled until it is indistinguishable from the nonexistent. Where the Bible tells us God once shaped worlds out of the void and parted great seas with the power of his word, today his most impressive acts seem to be shaping sticky buns into the likenesses of saints and conferring vaguely-defined warm feelings on his believers' hearts when they attend church. "
 
Quote from jem:

Excellent quote and thank you for engaging in serious discussing.
In your last paragraph you nailed it.

Our universe looks -- see quote above "extraordinarily fine tuned".
That is evidence of a creator.

However, Hawking goes on to explain that theoretical physics allows (this is very speculative and there is no proof) there could be almost infinite other universes.

--

So that is the point... of where many scientists are right now.

You can observe the extraordinary fine tunings in our universe...
leading a person with a brain to realize... those fine tunings need a tuner... in absence of new findings.

or

you can BELIEVE there are trillions and trillions of other so far unobserved universes... where anything can and has happened.

leading to the statement...

evidence of God or the necessity of unicorns but not neither.

It's amazing how you can take an entire passage from a book that explains why there is no creator, read one simple sentence (our universe looks extraordinarily fine tuned), and somehow determine that this means a creator exists.

I think you are delusional, and unable to see the other side of the argument.

Just keep on donating to the pot every Sunday at church and you will be happy for all eternity.
:D
 
Quote from shortie:

Hawking is in the book selling business. So, it is a safe bet that his book advertized as "The Answer" can't really deliver it.

Actually this adds credibility to Hawking's argument because he would surely sell more books had he come to the conclusion that yes, a creator does exist.
 
Quote from Kassz007:

Actually this adds credibility to Hawking's argument because he would surely sell more books had he come to the conclusion that yes, a creator does exist.

hold your horses, young man! wait until Hawking's book #3 (aka "Book of revelations about the REAL design of the Universe") comes out in a few years :D
 
Quote from jem:


You can observe the extraordinary fine tunings in our universe...
leading a person with a brain to realize... those fine tunings need a tuner...

The fact that the universe is fine tuned does not mean by any means that there must be a "tuner" as you say.
It simply means that the underlying structure of the universe is uncomparibly much better at sef'-regulating than the so-called "free market" :D
 
If you are not a g*d fearing man of faith, then you will be damned to an eternity of reading et threads.


Pass me the good book quick

IM003452.JPG
 
Quote from jem:

Excellent quote and thank you for engaging in serious discussing.

fine tunings need a tuner...

..and a tuner needs what ...a creator or another tuner....

Infinite regress ..... "engaging in serious discussing".. Lol.
 
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