Greece, or California, or a few other US states?

Quote from intradaybill:

What 100s of Billions, you must be out of your mind. Southern farmers were paid insentives NOT TO farm. This is crazy. At the same time, Germany established politicians in Greece who lived long and worked in Germany, married to German ladies who then signed huge inflated contracts with Siemens and stole the monies of the people. Are you aware of these facts? When are you going to stop lying that anyone stole 100s of billions from the northen european countries who you present as angles when those countries have been milking the south with implanted corruption with the objective of driving it broke and buying it cheap?

When the laws of EU force you to quite what you have been doing as a farmer for generations and they tell you take little money to stop farming you are going to inflate because in the future you will not be able to make a living. That technique was used by Germans and EU to corrupt people.
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"Overall, Greece has absorbed 240 billion euros in European aid over three decades - the equivalent to the country's GDP in 2010."

http://www.asiaone.com/Business/News/Story/A1Story20100430-213345.html
 
Quote from intradaybill:

What do you mean "aflot"? Are you a history idiot? Greece had a mere 1 billion public debt when it joined the EU. They were given incentives to stop doing agriculture and de-industrialize in favor of German companies. The same happened in other European countries. Nobody stood up in those countries to challenge the evil plan. They ended up importing everything from northen Europeans. The combined public debt of northen europe far exceeds the debt of south europe while they have no resources, no energy, no agriculture, basically only industrial goods.

You are German from what I gather and you are trying to push your country's agenda. But you cannot fool the outside world. Your agenda is causing harm to Europe and to US. The memories of Jews getting fried in ovens and Greek villages getting burned and pregnant women being raped and their fetuses extracted with knives are still alive. Germany it seems has not changed since the monstrosities it caused. Some Germans have changed but the majority opinion is that of hate for the rest of Europe except their friends in the North who populated the SS brigades.
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I spelled "afloat" clearly and correctly, so why are you suggesting I made a typing error?
I'm not German and the fact that you believe only Germany had prison camps which used ovens to stop the spread of disease and get rid of dead prisoners, tells a lot about how well you know history.
Don't forget when the evil Germans released giant fire-breathing dragons onto the gentle Greek farmers and used voodoo on little Greek boys.

The rest of what you wrote is also pure fiction. Countries who wanted to willfully remain in the first half of 20th century but have all the modern luxuries (Greece, Spain) are only now seeing that it's impossible.
GDP is measured per capita and so is debt, you are talking about some absolute numbers - I think you should take a few economics classes now.
Greeks chose to join the EU, no one force them - they could've chosen closer ties with Turkey or remain independent - geographically they had that choice.
 
Quote from peilthetraveler:

California has a $2 trillion dollar GDP. Its debt is $389 billion.
Italy has a $1.8 trillion dollar GDP. Its debt is $2 trillion.
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The biggest problem in Europe is Germany with a huge debt and they are trying to hide it by pointing the finger to other countries.
 
Quote from zdreg:

"Overall, Greece has absorbed 240 billion euros in European aid over three decades - the equivalent to the country's GDP in 2010."

http://www.asiaone.com/Business/News/Story/A1Story20100430-213345.html
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You and your alter ego D08 know sh*t about these things and I wonder if you just get kicks from doing propaganda or is this is your job maybe?

Countries when they were tricked into joining the old EMU they gave up their right to print currency at will. That "aid" you are talking about was the equivalent in ECU (the old euro) that the central European bank allowed those countries to print in local currency, i.,e. it was their money but they appeared as aid.

At the same time, when Germany was united, it was allowed by supervisory powers to print 800 Billion DM. Do you know those facts? Are you ever going to stop your propaganda in favor of Germany and their blood thirsty northern allies?

Greece, Portugal, Spain, and others were not allowed to exercise monetary policy for many years in order to go broke. Instead, they were offered "aid" packages in local currency until they joined to Euro. Learn the facts because you sound like a talking head.

The fact of the matter is that the European North is trying to steal the European south and possibly there will be another war in Europe. The Germans never stopped fighting for European domination. They will lose this time around too.
 
I'm zdreg's alter ego? news to me.

None of the southern countries had to join the EU. So despite the fact I dislike the EU and you are right about it all being about power and leverage, the southern countries reaped the benefits when things were good and now play victims as things are bad.
 
California by itself is one of the worlds largest economies ranking in at 5 or 6 iirc.

I wish California would secede then we could stop paying for the rest of the US and become Canada. CA taxpayers pay far more to the Fed Govt then what the state gets back.

How about we change basing the house of reps district lines by taxes paid instead of population ? Then we'd get rid of the low rent tea party.

The House wouldn't even be close to what it is now with a Republican majority.

And before you say rich people pay more taxes and would have more votes ... guess what they don't ... just ask Mitt Romney for his 20 years worth of taxes.
 
Quote from intradaybill:

What do you mean "aflot"? Are you a history idiot? Greece had a mere 1 billion public debt when it joined the EU. They were given incentives to stop doing agriculture and de-industrialize in favor of German companies. The same happened in other European countries. Nobody stood up in those countries to challenge the evil plan. They ended up importing everything from northen Europeans. The combined public debt of northen europe far exceeds the debt of south europe while they have no resources, no energy, no agriculture, basically only industrial goods.

You are German from what I gather and you are trying to push your country's agenda. But you cannot fool the outside world. Your agenda is causing harm to Europe and to US. The memories of Jews getting fried in ovens and Greek villages getting burned and pregnant women being raped and their fetuses extracted with knives are still alive. Germany it seems has not changed since the monstrosities it caused. Some Germans have changed but the majority opinion is that of hate for the rest of Europe except their friends in the North who populated the SS brigades.
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I think your point of view is out of line.

Greece is full of socialists, and they have no resources. Is there really any other reason for their crisis?

Since when was Greece actually industrialized? What did they do to the Nazi's to make "all Nazis to kill children with knives"-shit crumbled marbles on their swastika banners?

I'm no California bond holder, but I think things are much better than they were in 2009. A true crash is not in California's near term future.
 
Greece used to default with regularity even before they had socialists! People that don't care to pay back loans are going to go for socialism whole hog.
 
"From the mid-1980s to 2005, California's population grew by 10 million, while Medicaid recipients soared by seven million; tax filers paying income taxes rose by just 150,000; and the prison population swelled by 115,000."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...7277242682364690.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop

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California's problems run deep

"California is no longer an incubator of high-wage jobs. The state lost 370,000 jobs paying 25 percent or more of the average wage between 2000 and 2008. This compares to a 770,000 increase in the previous 8 years. California is trailing Texas badly and the nation overall in creating criticial STEM jobs and middle skills jobs (Figures 2 & 3) Only two states have higher unemployment rates than California (Nevada and Rhode Island)."

http://www.newgeography.com/content...phic,+and+political+commentary+about+places%2

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California cities filing for bankruptcy.

http://articles.cnn.com/2012-07-18/..._property-values-mammoth-lakes-san-bernardino

http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...r-bankruptcy/2012/07/22/gJQAOaeI2W_story.html

http://www.governing.com/topics/fin...s-bankruptcy-makes-normal-cities-nervous.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/18/compton-bankruptcy-ca-cit_n_1682866.html

In a television interview, the former budget director of Los Angeles said it's likely that LA will be filing for bankruptcy around 2015-16.
 
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