Good example of why unions are stupid as all hell

Quote from CaptainObvious:

What I've seen work is incentivised, merit pay type structures. The dead beats leave this type of organization rather quickly and you're left with good hard workers. One caveat. These workers must be rewarded. You must actually provide clear path of advancement opportunites for them. If it's only lip service the good help will take their skills down the road. It should also go without saying that you must stay on the cutting edge of whatever technology is pertinent to your business.

Agree, but my experience is that when we have proper incentives, most flock to that. A long time ago, one of my companies made a single product. We had a union, but we also gave them the option to be paid by number of units manufactured per shift. Well, they dumped the union and went on to make a hell of a lot more product. With several teams, not just individuals. Nice.
 
Quote from Tsing Tao:

I hope your friend voted for government officials that support right to work legislation.

I didn’t ask him who he voted for. But I am somewhat confused, as this sounds like you may actually care about the choices he has made, and what will be good for the American workforce- this contradicts much of what you have been saying since the election results.

Otherwise, he voted for people that support this type of thing happening.[/QUOTE]

I don’t recall Romney having any agenda that had anything to do with shutting down unions. I don’t remember that being on either one of the Bushs’ to-do list, or Grampa Reagan’s either.

It also makes him a hypocrite.[/QUOTE]

This statement does carry some weight coming from someone who has vowed to become the type of person he has loathed for so many years- you know, the type who will just take or steal whatever they can, at someone else’s expense, regardless of the consequences to others or our country.

You, sir, are well studied in the act of hypocrisy, and I have no doubts that you understand the subject to the fullest.


Your friend will likely be just fine, as the company buying the brands will need infrastructure to run it. [/QUOTE]

I’ll let him know that a guy who has given up on American values, and who has committed to drowning himself in cynicism says he should be fine.
I’m sure he’ll put the kids bicycles on lay-a-way as soon as he gets this terrific news (sarcasm).
 
Many production workers earned up to $20 an hour, plus had access to medical benefits, according to Michael O'Brien, a former Hostess employee who had worked at the company for 45 years, in various sales functions, before he was offered a buyout last year.
"People inside the plants really made a good living," O'Brien said. "I feel sorry for them." "We deeply regret taking this action," the company said. "Widespread strikes by the Bakers Union forced us to cease operations because we can longer produce or delivery product." Asked if the shutdown decision could be reversed if the Bakers' union agreed to immediately return to work, he responded, "Too late."

http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/16/news...html?hpt=hp_t2
 
Quote from Grandluxe:

Many production workers earned up to $20 an hour, plus had access to medical benefits, according to Michael O'Brien, a former Hostess employee who had worked at the company for 45 years, in various sales functions, before he was offered a buyout last year.
"People inside the plants really made a good living," O'Brien said. "I feel sorry for them." "We deeply regret taking this action," the company said. "Widespread strikes by the Bakers Union forced us to cease operations because we can longer produce or delivery product." Asked if the shutdown decision could be reversed if the Bakers' union agreed to immediately return to work, he responded, "Too late."

http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/16/news...html?hpt=hp_t2

OK. $20 per hour x 40 = $800 per week x 52 = $41,600 per year. Super for a family.

I am NOT pro union, but am FOR fairness in wages. Perhaps workers should take over the company.
 
Quote from mrbill:

OK. $20 per hour x 40 = $800 per week x 52 = $41,600 per year. Super for a family.

I am NOT pro union, but am FOR fairness in wages. Perhaps workers should take over the company.

Now you get nothing.....
 
Quote from mrbill:

OK. $20 per hour x 40 = $800 per week x 52 = $41,600 per year. Super for a family.

I am NOT pro union, but am FOR fairness in wages. Perhaps workers should take over the company.

There's something called competitive cost structure that's hard to get around.

Though I make my living as a trader, I'm also an investor in two local restaurants that have been modestly successful for over a decade. I'd like nothing more than to pay the restaurant employees more and buy them health insurance. There's just one problem. If we did that, there'd be no profits, no returns for the shareholders and no reason to keep the doors open. We can't raise our prices without losing customers.
 
Quote from Hoofhearted:

I didn’t ask him who he voted for. But I am somewhat confused, as this sounds like you may actually care about the choices he has made, and what will be good for the American workforce- this contradicts much of what you have been saying since the election results.

I don't care at all. My attempt was to be civil to you, who actually seemed to care. The guy could go fall off a cliff for all I know or care.


Quote from Hoofhearted:


I don’t recall Romney having any agenda that had anything to do with shutting down unions. I don’t remember that being on either one of the Bushs’ to-do list, or Grampa Reagan’s either.

It is a well established fact that the democratic party supports unions, and unions the democratic party. The republican party typically opposes unions. Is this the first time you have heard of this?

Quote from Hoofhearted:


This statement does carry some weight coming from someone who has vowed to become the type of person he has loathed for so many years- you know, the type who will just take or steal whatever they can, at someone else’s expense, regardless of the consequences to others or our country.

You, sir, are well studied in the act of hypocrisy, and I have no doubts that you understand the subject to the fullest.

Yes, if becoming a taker is the only way to get ahead in this country, why should I fight it? If that makes me a hypocrite, so be it! I was on the losing side of morality according to your party, so I need to straighten up and get in line for mah Obamah bling. Or whatever.


Quote from Hoofhearted:


I’ll let him know that a guy who has given up on American values, and who has committed to drowning himself in cynicism says he should be fine.
I’m sure he’ll put the kids bicycles on lay-a-way as soon as he gets this terrific news (sarcasm).

Or you could let him know that someone who has had 20 years in the consumer packaged goods industry (as Hostess was in) and has seen, executed and gone through multiple mergers in these situations says he will probably be fine. But you go ahead and phrase it however you like.

As you say, I couldn't give a shit.
 
Quote from mrbill:

OK. $20 per hour x 40 = $800 per week x 52 = $41,600 per year. Super for a family.

I am NOT pro union, but am FOR fairness in wages. Perhaps workers should take over the company.

You are, of course, eliminating overtime, benefits (approx 34% of salary), 401k plans, and pension. But hey, why let facts get in the way of a perfectly good argument?

How many folks out there would want $20 an hour jobs with all those benefits?
 
Quote from Hoofhearted:



Perhaps the silver lining will be that other unions and future companies can learn from the mistakes that are being made right now- but history hasn't proven itself to be a good teacher- at least not in this country.
If you are not willing to learn from the past:
Then fvck'em, stupid is as stupid does.
 
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