Going from equities to e-minis.....

Quote from coolweb:

lilduckling,
just start trading the eminis, its a good learning experience.

I'd rather learn from trading the eminis the true methology of TRADING instead of stocks where there are external bullshits such as market makers/stock upgrade downgrades/ etc..

In eMINIs,

There is nothing but TRADING, high volume, low volume into resistance, large panic buying, large euphoria buying, how to spot them , No volume at highs, head fakes, fades, why there are fades.

the TRUE essence of trading. Once you learn the ins and outs of trading, I Guarantee you, nothing can stand in your way when you trade for the longer term in stocks, you can spot them out from a mile away from tape reading/ volume and price.



It'll take awhile, but I'm sure if you work hard at it, trade in 1 lots, keep stop losts to $50 or less per transaction (quite important),
and have enough time and not give up (very important)

you will take trading to the NEXT level.

I believe you can do it!

lets get going and get on the work bus.


Thanks, any question feel free to ask.
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Now thats the kind of post that we need around here!!! Positive and yet informative....none of this "we mean you no harm earthling....take me to your leader" I was looking at the YM...that looks tame enough for me to handle....one contract and with a 10 pt stop its only risking $50.....i mean really now...i am up to risking 6 times that amount in stocks ... so why indeed can i not grab this YM by the tail and tame it....and learn how to trade it?


i could see if i had no clue about T.A. and chart reading .... but i do have some.

Thanks coolwed for your post....and the more people tell me i cant do something the more energy they give me to succeed.
 
Quote from lilduckling:

*Ahem*...... i know a "friend" who has a 50k account size..... how many contracts do you all think is the max he should trade??
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If he's GOOD... ALL 50!!

If he's BAD..... ZERO!! Have him look for a JOB!
:D
 
Quote from coolweb:

lilduckling
no spy is very similar to the futures emini ES
if you can try spy , you can trade the ES
it'll take you a week to get accustomed to the futures tick count

but I must say it correlates very fine, with futures exagerating movements a bit sometimes.

It is SPECTACULAR trading the indexes, just the best if you are TRADING,

Traders don't have much time in a day, so they can not research every night 20 stocks to trade, but with indexes, the preparation is shortned very much!


stocks are for investing
but I think INDEXES are the best for trading :)



hope this helps buddy :)
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Totally Agree!! Couldn't have said it better! :cool: :cool:
 
Quote from lilduckling:

hmmm ... i dont dought that, but in equities you have to put up with the mm & specialists games .... surprise news, earnings, upgrades/downgrades ..plus a whole truck load of scanning and research if you want to have a change of making $$ ....its taking up all my time...all my time. I was thinking that with e-minis i could have some time freed up.
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lilduckling,

I migrated from equities to ES/ER2. I feel that I wasted quite a bit of time on the equities. I also feel that whatever you decide to trade has it's own personality. As such, it was a great relief to focus all energy on beating just these.

Once the decision was made to switch, I very quickly was able to refine my systems. Next step was automation.

I turn the systems loose at 6:15 am (pacific) and turn off at 1:00. Intraday with no overnight holds. No emotions involved. Here's some goals;

Winners 76.92 %
Losers 23.08 %
Profit Factor 1.59
Risk-Reward Ratio 39.81
Sharpe Ratio of trades 8.66
K-Ratio 0.04

Actual results are better because I've got extreme worst case fills built into the systems. I'm not boasting or any of that crap. In fact I don't even post much since there's not a helluva lot for me to discuss.

A couple points;

- switch to futures
- totally define your system(s)
- backtest
- simulate for awhile
- automate
- go find other things to do

Finally, don't get involved with the negativity, there are some of us kicking butt and you can also. It takes hard work to make things simple.

jeff (BTW....ain't selling nuthin)
 
Quote from Equalizer:

Although the SPY will give an idea of what the ES is about, remember this. It will only give you an idea.

- Do not develop a mechanical system on the SPY thinking it will extract similar profits from the ES. If you wish to develop a mech system to trade the ES, do it on the ES - sure if you think having SPY as an input helps go for it, but test it on the ES.

- Be very careful with some of the crap that appears with alarming regularity on the SPY, but not on the ES (see pic).

Quite frankly, and this is just MHO, you are better off getting a simulator/simulated account to test trade the ES - if discretionary trading is your thing.
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Frankly I don't think there's a whole lot of difference between SPY and the ES other than the potential leverage. Movement is almost identical because of the arb that goes on between the two.

In your chart attachment the one striking discrepancy in the SPY toward the right hand edge of the chart is likely a bad tick. Other than that the two charts are very, very close.

The leverage works differently. Day trading the ES requires margin of $2K at IB. Some place evidently let you trade with much less. SPY on the other hand you can trade with 25% margin as a pattern day trader. An equivalent size in SPY (to an ES contract) is 500 shares approx., which at todays prices is approximately $62000. To trade that as a pattern day trader would take about $15,500. Trading a contract again would take $2K (or less) at IB as a day trade.

If you trade utilizing higher leverage in the ES, then obviously that leverage has the ability to impact you, good or bad. SPY will not impact you in quite the same way because of the lower degree of leverage. But the price movement itself is very, very close.

I think if a "system" works in ES, it will work in SPY.

OldTrader
 
I could explain what sex is like to you too, but it is best just trying it.

Surely, someone who has traded or is considered trading, doesn't even blink an eye at the possibility of losing say $2K when attempting a new business opportunity to see if it is viable?

Open an account. Trade ES/NQ/YM. Let us know when your $2k is $0.

nitro
Quote from lilduckling:

Hi....I would like feed back from traders who have gone from equities to e-minis. What aspect did you find the most difficult, and what aspect was easier??

Also...im thinking of trading strictly the SPY before the transition to get the hang of it....would i be wasting my time doing that??

THANKS
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Duck,

Please don't test anything but live charts realtime and demo trading..demo until you are correct most of the time....risk reward must be minimum 1 to 2 If u hope to survive....IMO.....YM intraday is what I do after ES/NQ not suitable for several reasons ..................trade 1 contract at first.....if u can't succeed with one contract you are destined for disaster if u up contracts ....u will lose faster.....u can do this but I detect an exhuberance that is dangerous for pocketbook...multiple contracts is only for those who are very experienced OR HAVE NO RISK MANAGEMENT ....You can't buy what u r looking for.............Keep daily charts but only for study with knowledge that only real time shows the picture THAT WILL MAKE U MONEY.............charts will show you wonderful stuff if you learn to read them...even intraday....the one comment made by cool "never give up" or something like that is golden...........Best of Luck and happy trading.....1 contract...1 contract...1 contract demo....demo........demo....and when you are sick of that,,,,do this .........1 contract....1contract........1contract....demo....demo..demo...NEVER TEST NEW STUFF WITH REAL MONEY, ONLY REALTIME....YOU CAN DO THIS.....SINCERELY
 
Quote from porgie:

Duck,

Please don't test anything but live charts realtime and demo trading..demo until you are correct most of the time....risk reward must be minimum 1 to 2 If u hope to survive....IMO.....YM intraday is what I do after ES/NQ not suitable for several reasons ..................trade 1 contract at first.....if u can't succeed with one contract you are destined for disaster if u up contracts ....u will lose faster.....u can do this but I detect an exhuberance that is dangerous for pocketbook...multiple contracts is only for those who are very experienced OR HAVE NO RISK MANAGEMENT ....You can't buy what u r looking for.............Keep daily charts but only for study with knowledge that only real time shows the picture THAT WILL MAKE U MONEY.............charts will show you wonderful stuff if you learn to read them...even intraday....the one comment made by cool "never give up" or something like that is golden...........Best of Luck and happy trading.....1 contract...1 contract...1 contract demo....demo........demo....and when you are sick of that,,,,do this .........1 contract....1contract........1contract....demo....demo..demo...NEVER TEST NEW STUFF WITH REAL MONEY, ONLY REALTIME....YOU CAN DO THIS.....SINCERELY
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Thanks for the advice porgie......
i plan on first taking some time to test several indicators, then after i will spend a few months testing them and learning how the YM trades.....i will start with one contract....just like when i started with stocks, my risk per trade was real low. I figure if i lose $$ constantly with one contract.... the last thing i wanna do is increase the contract sizes....anyways... theres always equities to nibble on while i learn the minis
 
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