going against the grain?

Quote from mBear:

Basically there are three trading emotions, all working against you (fear, greed, hope).

Hope works against you when you are in a loosing trade. You don't survive long until you at least put in rigid stop loss rule in your trading plan and adhere to them.

Fear causes you to exit early. Best solution is switch to the "adding to a winning position" mind set. You have a winning trade, where will you add on?

Greed causes you to think the market will run your direction forever. You must combat greed with a profit taking plan. Either A) targets or B) Time (e.g. exit on close in a trending market) C) trailing stop or D) some combination of A or B with C.

As to why you enter countertrend when you exited the trend early - you are mad at yourself and you are trying to take out your anger on the market. Same way people will be angry at themselves and yell at the people around them. You want the market to give to you what you couldn't do for yourself. Best way to counter this -

1) Realize you have this tendency (we pretty much all do - though I conquered it in my human relationships long ago, it took a while to recognize and conquer it in my "market relationship.")

2) In trading don't be afraid to jump back on the trend, even if you lost a few points of the trend by premature exit. Think of it as part of your first trade.

3) Even better, exit only part of your position with a target, and use a trailing stop on the other part. Then when you realized the trend is continuing, it is easier to add more positions.

Part of successful trading is the painful process of self examination. Why did I do that? How can I stop? You are on the right track by asking.

Good luck.

mBear
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Sheez... emotion this... emotion that...

The more you say, "I'm not afraid"... the more you become conscious of your "fear" and it kills you...

Why do you guys keep on talking these BS.

His problem is simply... lack of clarity with his trades... This guy has no sort of plan or any kind of discipline.

That's the bottom line. Stop whining... "Waaahhhh... I can't do it"... it's only a freagin' mouse click away... How serious are you about trading?

Why do you trade? To make yourself feel better or to make money...

Clarity, my friend.... clarity.
 
Quote from mBear:

As to why you enter countertrend when you exited the trend early - you are mad at yourself and you are trying to take out your anger on the market. Same way people will be angry at themselves and yell at the people around them. You want the market to give to you what you couldn't do for yourself. Best way to counter this -
mBear [/B]
More...

This is a GREAT point.. I didn't realize I was doing this until

I made dumb trades after missing a profit opportunity, after making a bad trade and after getting out of a trade too early..

Once I was made aware of the above.. i.e. being mad at yourself causes you to do impulsive trading.. which is never good..

Pay attention to your emotions after these things happen to you.. You will soon see exactly what mBear is referring to..

Thanks mBear or whoever it was ..for pointing that out.. Its helped me understand my reactions trememdously
 
This is a GREAT point.. I didn't realize I was doing this until

I made dumb trades after missing a profit opportunity, after making a bad trade and after getting out of a trade too early..

How the hell are you going to make a dumb trade if you have a solid plan and the discipline to follow it?


Once I was made aware of the above.. i.e. being mad at yourself causes you to do impulsive trading.. which is never good..

Heh??? :confused: So being happy makes you do better trades? Taking that to your extreme... smoke some weed and trade...


Pay attention to your emotions after these things happen to you.. You will soon see exactly what mBear is referring to..

Pay attention to the market... Do you actually think that you've got this psychic ability within you that you are unaware of unconsciously??? No... seriously... you trade the market... you're full attention goes towards the market, not what you emote...


Thanks mBear or whoever it was ..for pointing that out.. Its helped me understand my reactions trememdously

*sike*

Do you guys really understand what Trading Psychology is? Why do you attach automatically attach emotions? That's probably the biggest flaws you guys have... Where's perception? Where's perspective? Where's positive or negative traumatic experiences?

:( ... Dudes... start reading some real books...

Maybe too much trading mentor books that has no idea but are good salesman... :(
 
Quote from WDGann:

This is a GREAT point.. I didn't realize I was doing this until

I made dumb trades after missing a profit opportunity, after making a bad trade and after getting out of a trade too early..

How the hell are you going to make a dumb trade if you have a solid plan and the discipline to follow it?


Once I was made aware of the above.. i.e. being mad at yourself causes you to do impulsive trading.. which is never good..

Heh??? :confused: So being happy makes you do better trades? Taking that to your extreme... smoke some weed and trade...


Pay attention to your emotions after these things happen to you.. You will soon see exactly what mBear is referring to..

Pay attention to the market... Do you actually think that you've got this psychic ability within you that you are unaware of unconsciously??? No... seriously... you trade the market... you're full attention goes towards the market, not what you emote...


Thanks mBear or whoever it was ..for pointing that out.. Its helped me understand my reactions trememdously

*sike*

Do you guys really understand what Trading Psychology is? Why do you attach automatically attach emotions? That's probably the biggest flaws you guys have... Where's perception? Where's perspective? Where's positive or negative traumatic experiences?

:( ... Dudes... start reading some real books...

Maybe too much trading mentor books that has no idea but are good salesman... :(
More...

WDGann,

What I'm saying or trying to say is that I'm trying to learn what makes me deviate from my plan.. Those of us that deviate from our trading plan is usually due to some type of emotions..What emotions am I experiencing that are making me continuously break my rules..
And when I deviate from my plan.. sometimes I'm angry and sometimes I am happy.. depending on the outcome usually..

Those of us that are not as great and wonderful as you are still struggling.. and my biggest problem is emotions.. too much emotions in my trading.. which causes me to take trades that are not in my plan.. or break rules of my plan once in a trade..

When I trade without emotions.. like you said trade the market.. and nothing else. not profit/loss.. not to make up for losses.. not to try and make the big bucks. I trade very well.. those are the occasions when I'm disciplined, patient and I follow my plan..

I love you guys who post trying to shoot down others.. if you are so good at this.. please.. I beg you.. Give me some advice..

What exactly is Trading Psychology in your view??

Elighten me.. I'm all ears..
 
Quote from jjjjjjjjjjjjj:

This is probably true WD GANNs post any other suggestions?
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being a systems trader... I differentiate myself from my system. It is not me encountering drawdowns, it is the system encountering drawdowns. I am not saying it's not necessary to analyze oneself, but in my opinion, separating the two helps me keep things in perspective.

Rules are very important. Test your ideas. If it works well on paper, try it with demo or small bets. Once you understand how the system works, try it for real.

Andy
 
Quote from Flashboy:

WDGann,

What I'm saying or trying to say is that I'm trying to learn what makes me deviate from my plan.. Those of us that deviate from our trading plan is usually due to some type of emotions..What emotions am I experiencing that are making me continuously break my rules..
And when I deviate from my plan.. sometimes I'm angry and sometimes I am happy.. depending on the outcome usually..

Those of us that are not as great and wonderful as you are still struggling.. and my biggest problem is emotions.. too much emotions in my trading.. which causes me to take trades that are not in my plan.. or break rules of my plan once in a trade..

When I trade without emotions.. like you said trade the market.. and nothing else. not profit/loss.. not to make up for losses.. not to try and make the big bucks. I trade very well.. those are the occasions when I'm disciplined, patient and I follow my plan..

I love you guys who post trying to shoot down others.. if you are so good at this.. please.. I beg you.. Give me some advice..

What exactly is Trading Psychology in your view??

Elighten me.. I'm all ears..
More...

Heh...

You've already answered your question. You've got experience trading without emotions and it worked out well.

So what the hell is your question? What kind of enlightenment are you looking for?

You've already proven a solution to yourself...
 
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