My real difficulty is following the system. I find it hard to stick to the system if a long losing streak appears. I am sticking to my system so far. It gets hard sometimes.
Getting Started Developing and Trading System
- Thread starter Gyles
- Start date
S
sokoban
As long as the system's stats in real trading are within the expected range resulted from back-testing it, then one should be like a robot when trading. It's only when it starts behaving in an unexpected way that one should be concerned and find the causes.
I found that systems that are more profitable than expected at some point also must be treated cautiously - that may mean larger losses as well at some other time. They are also difficult to trade consistently, as the tendency is to become overly confident, increase the amount of risk, which will almost certainly lead to larger losses during a drawdown period.
My 2c,
s
I found that systems that are more profitable than expected at some point also must be treated cautiously - that may mean larger losses as well at some other time. They are also difficult to trade consistently, as the tendency is to become overly confident, increase the amount of risk, which will almost certainly lead to larger losses during a drawdown period.
My 2c,
s
A Review of TradeStation
This product has been a standard in the Trading market for a very long time and has two versions available at the moment.
The first version â2000iâ was released in 2000 (hence the name) and is available only outside the US. At the moment, it seems to be past its prime usage, yet its charting is worthwhile. Moreover, its own global server allows you to save data collected on your own hard disk.
Moreover, I have gone through message boards, forums and the like as well as discussed with a few friends of mine who have the TraderStation 2000i. So far, I have a good review regarding this product.
Being an âend of day traderâ, so I do not pay much attention or rather do not care much over the real time data. Instead the trading portfolioâs of commodities and stocks is what matters to me and is not provided by the TradeStation 2000i.
Although eight year later on, I felt that its new version, the new online 8.3 one might be able to provide the above. However, that was not the case.
There were some points that were surprisingly. You can not apply money management rules on a portfolio of systems and markets; nor can you develop, optimize and test a system on a portfolio. It was surprising to note that TradeStation does everything: one market, system and set of parameters at a time!
Let us forget the fact that I was just testing a bunch of Trading software systems. The impression I get on using TradeStation is that they seem to concentrate their efforts in getting more brokerage. They do not really wish to make advancements in the software as per the requirements of the dynamic face of the markets (as mentioned in the ET forums). Although, they do provide add-ons which can provide the above, they are as expensive as the other software on our list taken for evaluation.
Anyway, I do admit it has plus points, among them is the availability of all the existing âEasyLanguageâ code available.
As a conclusion, if you as a trader is not trading real time over a short term, the on-line version is not worth the purchase and you are better off using the earlier version, the âTraderStation 2000iâ, provided you find it. This is the real problem, as getting one is tough. You can lay your hands on it only if you live outside US or if you find someone willing to sell existing copies of the same software.
Moreover, on searching the forums of the ET, had come across the following links stating the problems of the TradeStation, please comment.
- Tradestation Forex down, been 2 hours now...
- I'm sick of trade station
- What are the downsides to TradeStation?
- TradeStation data problems...
- TradeStation Servers?
This product has been a standard in the Trading market for a very long time and has two versions available at the moment.
The first version â2000iâ was released in 2000 (hence the name) and is available only outside the US. At the moment, it seems to be past its prime usage, yet its charting is worthwhile. Moreover, its own global server allows you to save data collected on your own hard disk.
Moreover, I have gone through message boards, forums and the like as well as discussed with a few friends of mine who have the TraderStation 2000i. So far, I have a good review regarding this product.
Being an âend of day traderâ, so I do not pay much attention or rather do not care much over the real time data. Instead the trading portfolioâs of commodities and stocks is what matters to me and is not provided by the TradeStation 2000i.
Although eight year later on, I felt that its new version, the new online 8.3 one might be able to provide the above. However, that was not the case.
There were some points that were surprisingly. You can not apply money management rules on a portfolio of systems and markets; nor can you develop, optimize and test a system on a portfolio. It was surprising to note that TradeStation does everything: one market, system and set of parameters at a time!
Let us forget the fact that I was just testing a bunch of Trading software systems. The impression I get on using TradeStation is that they seem to concentrate their efforts in getting more brokerage. They do not really wish to make advancements in the software as per the requirements of the dynamic face of the markets (as mentioned in the ET forums). Although, they do provide add-ons which can provide the above, they are as expensive as the other software on our list taken for evaluation.
Anyway, I do admit it has plus points, among them is the availability of all the existing âEasyLanguageâ code available.
As a conclusion, if you as a trader is not trading real time over a short term, the on-line version is not worth the purchase and you are better off using the earlier version, the âTraderStation 2000iâ, provided you find it. This is the real problem, as getting one is tough. You can lay your hands on it only if you live outside US or if you find someone willing to sell existing copies of the same software.
Moreover, on searching the forums of the ET, had come across the following links stating the problems of the TradeStation, please comment.
- Tradestation Forex down, been 2 hours now...
- I'm sick of trade station
- What are the downsides to TradeStation?
- TradeStation data problems...
- TradeStation Servers?
For me the real power of TradeStation are the resources available that help one learn both Easy Language and different aspects of Trading. It is really the 3rd party code via books, like Perry Kaufman's 'New Trading Systems and Methods' or Stridsman's "Trading Systems that Work" that I think make a real difference.
TradeStation sometimes has some problems but they have a very talented programming staff and are quick to address real problems. Is it harder for them to work than if they only had 2 or 3 developers, I am sure it is, but look at the breadth and depth of the product.
I also have C-Trader and TradingSolutions RT and still use both of these platforms also. I originally used MetaStock endofday, and I do miss it's feature for testing a strategy against a group of stocks and some of the cool 'Commentary' training on things like candlesticks.
{back to topic}
The example strategies that come with TradeStation are pretty good. So are the old Omega Strategy Club strategies if you can find them. The strategies provided by TradingSolutions Solution Service are also quite good. I think a trader can take a good strategy and make money and many people keep looking for something better and continue to lose money. It is better to find something that works and then make it yours. Don't spend all your time writing code unless you are getting paid enough.
TradeStation sometimes has some problems but they have a very talented programming staff and are quick to address real problems. Is it harder for them to work than if they only had 2 or 3 developers, I am sure it is, but look at the breadth and depth of the product.
I also have C-Trader and TradingSolutions RT and still use both of these platforms also. I originally used MetaStock endofday, and I do miss it's feature for testing a strategy against a group of stocks and some of the cool 'Commentary' training on things like candlesticks.
{back to topic}
The example strategies that come with TradeStation are pretty good. So are the old Omega Strategy Club strategies if you can find them. The strategies provided by TradingSolutions Solution Service are also quite good. I think a trader can take a good strategy and make money and many people keep looking for something better and continue to lose money. It is better to find something that works and then make it yours. Don't spend all your time writing code unless you are getting paid enough.
Gyles wrote:
"Instead the trading portfolioâs of commodities and stocks is what matters to me ..."
If you're into that, you might want to look into Trading Recipes. It's quite similar to TS, but with portfolio testing and management built into its system development and testing. Its language is similar to EasyLangauge but there are slight differences.
The original version was a 16 bit DOS version, never made the migration to Win32 and never became popular like TS. The last I heard, the latest version is supposed to be Win32 capable, just when everyone is ready to make the leap to 64 bit computing....
"Instead the trading portfolioâs of commodities and stocks is what matters to me ..."
If you're into that, you might want to look into Trading Recipes. It's quite similar to TS, but with portfolio testing and management built into its system development and testing. Its language is similar to EasyLangauge but there are slight differences.
The original version was a 16 bit DOS version, never made the migration to Win32 and never became popular like TS. The last I heard, the latest version is supposed to be Win32 capable, just when everyone is ready to make the leap to 64 bit computing....
Murray Ruggiero
Sponsor
TradersStudio has portfolio level testing, totally programmable money management. You can even apply money management rules across multiple systems. You can optimize a portfolio and also access the individual results without reoptimizing something that from what I understand Mechanica (Trading Recipes for Windows) can't do.
Trading Recipes language is like EasyLanguage , with slight differences is like saying, C++ is just like Visual basic. TradersStudio can automatically translate existing EasyLanguage code using a tool which comes with the product and run it. You can't do that with Mechanica, to me that is slight differences.
TradersStudio has all the features of Mechanica or Trading Blox and more and is only 1/5 the price.
Trading Recipes language is like EasyLanguage , with slight differences is like saying, C++ is just like Visual basic. TradersStudio can automatically translate existing EasyLanguage code using a tool which comes with the product and run it. You can't do that with Mechanica, to me that is slight differences.
TradersStudio has all the features of Mechanica or Trading Blox and more and is only 1/5 the price.
So, Gyles you have started testing.
What kind of machine do you plan on running the software one once you select it?
Metastock Analysis , Product Comparison
It is not easy to write complex programming like in TradeStation EasyLanguage, although OLE to excel is a plus. Moreover, issues like portfolio analysis and money management are missing. There are also problems with large optimizations
Question is why are the two most established company products not meeting the requested needs of the customers?
MetaStock seems to have been a good product before being taken over by Reuters where it has gone down in terms of quality, performance and apathetic customer service. The Reuters data feed is less than accurate and their support is indifferent at Reuters Data.
Backtester in Metastock is a real issue. Even, the support staff is not aware when the problems would be solved. Moreover, it is consumes a lot of resources, and you shall need a fast computer for using it in real-time with several charts open. Tradestation is a better choice. Moreover, many recommend other programs for serious trading and not MetaStock.
MetaStockâs strategy programming interface is also limited. It has an issue regarding the optimization. The database files are not cleared (made empty) after each optimization, which is troubling as whatever was saved earlier, a small optimization can cause a crash in MetaStock. Thus, one need to re-install MetaStock and all the historical testing results saved earlier is lost. Not a good thing.
EOD (older version, not the real-time version) is at least better. However, MetaStock has got good graphics and drawing capabilities.
MetaStock Pro- If you draw your trading numbers from chart formations and common indicators and use custom formulae, then MetaStock Pro has the capability to do so. Another good point is that, you can archive data on your hard drive (vs. running live charts from the server of your data source), as MetaStock Pro does not consume that much computer resources.
System Tester in MetaStock has problems and the response to this issue from the support is poor. Although Yahoo Boards have suggested ways to solve the bugs, the ways are not all that easy to use.
It is a general feeling that although MetaStock may have improved, they feel other products like TraderStation 2000i are a better bet.
Moreover, TradeStation though popular, does lack some important issues; for instance, the historical testing like portfolio testing or money management is not there. Moreover, you do not have much access except to the TradeStation historical data and require paying a monthly fee in order to be able to run your system on this web-based application.
It is not easy to write complex programming like in TradeStation EasyLanguage, although OLE to excel is a plus. Moreover, issues like portfolio analysis and money management are missing. There are also problems with large optimizations
Question is why are the two most established company products not meeting the requested needs of the customers?
MetaStock seems to have been a good product before being taken over by Reuters where it has gone down in terms of quality, performance and apathetic customer service. The Reuters data feed is less than accurate and their support is indifferent at Reuters Data.
Backtester in Metastock is a real issue. Even, the support staff is not aware when the problems would be solved. Moreover, it is consumes a lot of resources, and you shall need a fast computer for using it in real-time with several charts open. Tradestation is a better choice. Moreover, many recommend other programs for serious trading and not MetaStock.
MetaStockâs strategy programming interface is also limited. It has an issue regarding the optimization. The database files are not cleared (made empty) after each optimization, which is troubling as whatever was saved earlier, a small optimization can cause a crash in MetaStock. Thus, one need to re-install MetaStock and all the historical testing results saved earlier is lost. Not a good thing.
EOD (older version, not the real-time version) is at least better. However, MetaStock has got good graphics and drawing capabilities.
MetaStock Pro- If you draw your trading numbers from chart formations and common indicators and use custom formulae, then MetaStock Pro has the capability to do so. Another good point is that, you can archive data on your hard drive (vs. running live charts from the server of your data source), as MetaStock Pro does not consume that much computer resources.
System Tester in MetaStock has problems and the response to this issue from the support is poor. Although Yahoo Boards have suggested ways to solve the bugs, the ways are not all that easy to use.
It is a general feeling that although MetaStock may have improved, they feel other products like TraderStation 2000i are a better bet.
Moreover, TradeStation though popular, does lack some important issues; for instance, the historical testing like portfolio testing or money management is not there. Moreover, you do not have much access except to the TradeStation historical data and require paying a monthly fee in order to be able to run your system on this web-based application.