George Fontanills

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Just because you have more posts than I do, does not justify your credibility...it just means you're quite a writer. :)

I've been trading options for a number of years and have tried many systems. I've found from the books that Fontanils writes that he doesn't give you everything he currently gives you in the seminars. Alot has changed in the past 8 years and I find that when his students complain on any issues, he listens and makes amends. If you just attend the first 1/2 of the current seminar, you are missing out on the valuable stuff during the other portion. One thing you would find out is that he doesn't do only delta neutral trading. Based on the current trend of the market there are certain strategies that work better than others. You should look at his newest book out..."The Volatility Course".

I'm truly not trying to sell you on him but as a successful student of his seminars, I'm just trying to set the information in this thread to fact instead of fiction.
 
Originally posted by camp
Just because you have more posts than I do, does not justify your credibility...it just means you're quite a writer. :)
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True, but we since we all know trading is a game of probabilities and risk, if you were doing a stat arb you could:

- go short the probability that I am vendor shill for Fontanills
- go long the probability that you might be a vendor shill for Fontanills

Worse case- you lose some slippage & commissions. Best case- one nice trade.

I've found from the books that Fontanils writes that he doesn't give you everything he currently gives you in the seminars. Alot has changed in the past 8 years and I find that when his students complain on any issues, he listens and makes amends.
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How do you know what the course and/or books looked like 8 years ago?

Btw, while we are throwing facts out, here's a fact: out of everyone I've corresponded with who has taken the Fontanills course in past 2 years (I don't know exact # but I estimate 5-6 people), every single one of them has said that everything they learned from the course you could learn by reading a good book or two on options. If it helps you to be in a seminar atmosphere to learn, then maybe the seminar is worth it. But clearly the marketing hype is a bit much, wouldn't you agree?
 
At the last seminar I attended there was a guy sitting near me who had been going to the seminars since 1993 and he was happy, fairly successful, and still attending for the updated strategies and further education. Another fellow I remembered from another seminar who I asked how he was doing, said he was still scared to make his first trade, which he planned to do in Feb. 2003. Two women asked me how to open a brokerage account and another man had turned $10,000 into mid-six figures in less than a year. So as with anything there is a wide range of people and their stories. Probably the success rate or failure rate may be about the same as any oher type of trading or small business startup. I know there are people who walked out on one hand and others who are estatic. To each his own. :) LOL
 
Originally posted by Doubter
I know there are people who walked out on one hand and others who are estatic. To each his own. :) LOL
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True. But what if you later realized that what you paid for in a seminar was readily available in well known options trading books?

Let's also look at the Fontanills aproach- hard sales pitch marketing materials ala Wade Cook/Ken Roberts, the "attend the first day seminar and you can go home if you don't like what you hear trick" when all the first day's seminar is a pitch on how money you can make if you come back tomorrow, look at all of the Optionetics shills that posted on misc.invest.options on Usenet in prior years before message boards were popular on the Internet, look at how Fontanills threatened to sue and shut up all the people who attended his seminar and are posting negative feedback on M.I.O., look at the # of people who complained about not getting a refund for the seminar after the second day when that was promised at one point, the poor performance of the wealthwire/hotfax service at $300/month, the total failure of his Market insider series day trading software sold for $5000, not honoring the 100% money-back guarantee on the software, the aggressive marketing approach used by Fontanills once he gets your mailing address, the typical vendor huckster approach of using flashy cars and fancy houses in different cities on the introductory marketing mailer, the follow-up mailing if you don't respond to the first saying you can double-your-money-in-3-months, the "pay $19 for this book" ad which itself was classic Windsor Books material only to discover that you paid $19 for virtually no details about delta-neutral strategies but actually bought a booklet advertising the full course for thousands.... look at all these things and ask yourself if you're getting honest value for your dollar?

Sure, you might learn something. But maybe you'd learn a lot more just spending an evening at the book store?
 
I like your last statements...not all optionetic students are successful....not all see value in the seminars...not all follow the rules of the game.

I believe, yes...you can find all the information in books and on the internet but how much time do you have in your life to do this??? Are you a doer or do you just sit on the sidelines and watch the richer get rich and the poorer get poorer. I'm a doer...some days are great and others are bad...in my humble opinion, no matter what system you do or who you think is great or terrible...at the end of the day what matters is how well you played the game, wouldn't you agree?
 
Originally posted by camp
at the end of the day what matters is how well you played the game, wouldn't you agree?
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What about the cost of learning how to play the game?

Would you pay me several thousand dollars to teach you basics of TA?

But you are willing to pay several thousand dollars to learn basics of options?

Have you ever in your life responded to any other marketing materials that featured fancy cars, fancy houses, promises to "double your money in 3 months" and other similar hard core marketing gimmicks? If so, what were the results?
 
One more thing, the people who asked for refunds from Fontanils most likely didn't read the contract to understand the rules to qualify for a refund....there's an objective to every item you mentioned...truly it's your choice whether you like Fontanils or whether you don't...like Doubter stated...to each his own...but I'm a true believer of him...and I'm not paid by him or employeed by his organization :)
 
In answer to your questions...if you don't have the money to invest then don't play the game.

I found value in my investment with Optionetics and have a great ROI to show for it...without going through the course, you'll never know whether it would make you successful or not and why would I like to know about TA when I have a very successful system??? What's the value???
 
Like alot of people, old George capitalized on the raging bull market of the late nineties when buying bull call spreads on volatile network and optical stocks that moved 30-40 points a day could make these strategies pretty decent bets. Since then George is sucking wind.

Still sending out the same old ranging bull shit pamphlets with him supposedly standing next to one of his successful immigrant students. Come on shill. Give me a break. If I was raking in the money that George does making his outlandish claims and promises, I could be a successful option trader too. You could afford all of the market loses and then publish the few extraordinary winners that he happens to trip on by chance.

My advice to everyone......... Save your money for your trading account, don't give it to George for his. Study hard and practice strict money management. Options tend to appeal to get rich quick mentalities where people take on way too large a position and unintentionally lose it all through unexpected moves and then running out of time.
 
If I attended college for 6 years it must have been a waste of money when everything I learned I could have gotten at the library free. College wasn't free and I am sure you could get all the learning at the library but many people use the college route.
If someones ROI was 50-80 times the investment you can tell them they are stupid but they might not believe you. I would not tell you to attend or not attend because I would not want to be responsible for your decision. For some it works and for others it doesn't.:) Go figure.
 
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