Gaining Muscle and Losing Fat (2015)

[Frederick Foresight]

wjk, I'm familiar with the standard remedial exercises prescribed by physiotherapists. However, the best thing that I ever did for my shoulders was not flaring my elbows towards 90 degrees for pushing movements, be they vertical or horizontal. I think if you flare your elbows no more than about 45 degrees you'll be doing your shoulders a favor. So definitely no behind the neck shoulder presses. I think other exercises to avoid are behind the neck pull downs/pull ups, and upright rows.

Personally, I dislike all forms of shoulder isolation work. Laterals? They certainly have no evolutionary relevance that I can think of aside from possibly being a form of punishment for high crimes. But I admit to a bias. As I noted earlier in this thread I only do compounds, going for the maximum bang for the buck in terms of both efficiency and metabolic effect. (With the only exception being calf raises.)

 

[destriero]

^^^

Basically, don't do any movement that forces the body into an isometric stance, or is an unnatural movement. When would you ever use a lateral raise in day to day activities?

And yeah, No behind the back movements (classic squat is not -- resting on shoulders).

 

[destriero]

I will also add that you maintain proper proportions when doing compound work. The CF/Oly people are usually symmetrical and proportioned. You never see a guy with tiny thighs and a huge upper body.

 

[wjk]

Laterals? They certainly have no evolutionary relevance that I can think of aside from possibly being a form of punishment for high crimes.

Lol. How high of crimes?

 

[wjk]

Most ppl in gyms are untrained and do the dumbest shit imaginable, even if they're ripped. It's not that it won't work the group (uprights are shit in that regard, and dumb), but stuff like tri extensions force you into a isometric position, or worse.

Agree, but most of the really dumb ones aren't ripped, except for maybe their tendons, and possibly a few muscles. Regarding upright rows, I agree. They can damage the AC and the RC. And impingement is a real issue.

 

[jimmiebarton]

your snatch is all about "up right rows +moment'?

god damn idiots

 

[wjk]

your snatch is all about "up right rows +moment'?

What are you talking about? There is no up right row in a snatch, is there? Are you referring to a power snatch? No upright row in that. Might be a kegel joke in there, though!

 

[destriero]

your snatch is all about "up right rows +moment'?

god damn idiots

A snatch? wtf? Do an upright row with a snatch grip and let us know how that works for you.

The C&J is elbow in and tight, while a upright row is elbow-out. Power cleans are great, but elbow out = impingement and loss of brain cells.

 

[jimmiebarton]

Dumbass, it's from the floor, elbow in and tight, while a upright row is elbow-out. Power cleans are great, but elbow out = impingement and loss of brain cells.

yous an asshole

 

[wjk]

elbow out = impingement and loss of brain cells.

LOL.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is no upright row in the traditional sense in any snatch. In a power clean, the elbows snap to under the bar as the top part of the move is approached, no? An upright row (as I was taught) is simply standing with a bar or dumbbell(s) at waist level, then lifting straight up parallel to the body to about chest level, give or take...with the elbows flaring out during the positive portion of the lift.

I did the uprights for a time, but long since stopped. They were painful to do, and not in a good way. My grip width didn't make much of a difference on them (some guys held there hands together, others shoulder width). Whether I'm doing compound lifts or isolation lifts, I don't do anything that doesn't feel natural at a given weight (as you indicated in a prior post). That is my ultimate guide. Upright rows never felt good, at least to me.