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Futures Scalping
- Thread starter OkComp
- Start date
Alexis, todays computers are perfectly fine for "homebased" traders. Surely homebased players are not "arbing" as a strategy. You apparently were not around when we all "traded" by picking up the telephone and being at the mercy of some low life that answered the phone.
Ok, now why i posted. In futures terms a HANDLE is the whole and a TICK is a part of the HANDLE.
Example: ES = 1098.50 The HANDLE is 8 which is a whole number. The fraction of the HANDLE 8 is .50 or since the ES trades in 1/4 fractions the .50 means 2 TICKS of the whole.
Lets say you were trading in the pit (forget what the FAT SP500 increments are), in this example assume the ES trades in the pit. Ok, in the pit price is auctioned in parts of the whole handle..........in 1/4 increments, CALLED TICKS. 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, then the HANDLE jumps or declines by a whole digit.
It is up to the trader to KNOW where the HANDLE is.
The DOW industrial average is quoted to everyone in POINTS. "Today the DOW went up 35 points"
A TICK is a PART of something. A HANDLE is a WHOLE part of a futures price where a POINT is a whole of some stock average which many just carry over to quote stock prices. POINTS are NOT used in quoting futures prices.
The POINT being: Get a HANDLE on what you are quoting and quit TICKING around with the small stuff.
:eek:
Ok, now why i posted. In futures terms a HANDLE is the whole and a TICK is a part of the HANDLE.
Example: ES = 1098.50 The HANDLE is 8 which is a whole number. The fraction of the HANDLE 8 is .50 or since the ES trades in 1/4 fractions the .50 means 2 TICKS of the whole.
Lets say you were trading in the pit (forget what the FAT SP500 increments are), in this example assume the ES trades in the pit. Ok, in the pit price is auctioned in parts of the whole handle..........in 1/4 increments, CALLED TICKS. 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, then the HANDLE jumps or declines by a whole digit.
It is up to the trader to KNOW where the HANDLE is.
The DOW industrial average is quoted to everyone in POINTS. "Today the DOW went up 35 points"
A TICK is a PART of something. A HANDLE is a WHOLE part of a futures price where a POINT is a whole of some stock average which many just carry over to quote stock prices. POINTS are NOT used in quoting futures prices.
The POINT being: Get a HANDLE on what you are quoting and quit TICKING around with the small stuff.
:eek:
Don't trust the results you get with the Firetip platform. It is filling you at unreasonable levels. For instance when you click the buy the bid as soon as it trades at the bid you get filled. In real life it has to move one tick above the bid for you to get filled. Plus the platform has it's own issues that are also issues in real life trading. I used it during the summer and after I had closed my position with a modest profit it still showed me in a position. So I clicked the "Go Flat" button and the SOB put me into a real position instead. I lost half of my modest profit on that little lesson.
Firtip is FARR Financial platform so regardless of who your broker is they are actually an IB for FARR.
Lcash
Firtip is FARR Financial platform so regardless of who your broker is they are actually an IB for FARR.
Lcash
I have been scalping the CL for three years now, which is considered crazy for many and I have been averaging about 300.00 a day for the past two years. I don't keep more than 20k in the account. I don't give a shit who believes me or not on this site. Plus its not my main source of income but it sure helps. I dont live breathe and eat trading I get my profit and shut the PC off. I like life. I use to be in front of the screen 24/7 traded stocks, the ES, you name it and lost my ass years ago. I then befriended the CL it has been nice and steady no heroics. So yes it can be done as long as your disciplined and not aiming to take over the world. I had a good run a few weeks ago and my account hit 40k, I took out 15k right away. 25k is my max in this account. My goal is to accumulate as much money as I can into my checking account instead of impressing my broker and taking it to 200k, been there done that, and have given quite a bit back. Its all up to you the market will always throw you a small bone. For me Im good for 2-400 a day on the CL without a flinch. I have days where I get more but I know daily I get this pretty easily. Good luck.
With TT you know from fill where you are in line (set in options menu); if you buy 23 and you are 489 of 500 and offers don't dramatically reduce your place in que you might infer that it may not go offer. If you think that you may be wrong you can pull your order and resubmit it later. Some guys place orders at distant levels before floor starts to trade in order to be first in line.
Ticks, well 3 10-yr Notes (ZN) ticks is about 1 full ES handle as fees are considerably less. Work up to 10-lot and you're in business.
I watch other instruments and though not technically arbing the principal applies. It can help me confirm and get a jump on getting in. Get to know your markets and the company they keep. 'Spreading' is also present and can often be seen in the book (TT 'pro' is designed for this purpose).
Yea, buying and selling on phone was not fun, but I did it...starting with Ag futures, NYFE, SP, (the $500 monster), OEX and don't miss it even with phone to floor.
I would emphasize again to get the facts. You have to find your own way. Even good traders don't necessarily make good teachers/mentors. In fact I won't tell my younger son "how to trade," especially when I see he has a knack for it. I could ruin it for him.
To whom ever started this Q&A (sorry i forgot who for the moment) I would emphasize that you should pretty much ignore any "advice" you get from here. If you can trade with real money that's the proof (if you fail go back to the drawing board); I don't care if you trade Diamonds or eggs (well I don't think eggs now--anyone know how they were traded btw?)
The reason I started trading began in the 1970's when I knew the son of an investment banker who became a broker. They lived in a 5th Ave apartment in the 70's, for those of you who know NYC. I bought some stock options and then went fishing and the Allatola started a revolution.
Ticks, well 3 10-yr Notes (ZN) ticks is about 1 full ES handle as fees are considerably less. Work up to 10-lot and you're in business.
I watch other instruments and though not technically arbing the principal applies. It can help me confirm and get a jump on getting in. Get to know your markets and the company they keep. 'Spreading' is also present and can often be seen in the book (TT 'pro' is designed for this purpose).
Yea, buying and selling on phone was not fun, but I did it...starting with Ag futures, NYFE, SP, (the $500 monster), OEX and don't miss it even with phone to floor.
I would emphasize again to get the facts. You have to find your own way. Even good traders don't necessarily make good teachers/mentors. In fact I won't tell my younger son "how to trade," especially when I see he has a knack for it. I could ruin it for him.
To whom ever started this Q&A (sorry i forgot who for the moment) I would emphasize that you should pretty much ignore any "advice" you get from here. If you can trade with real money that's the proof (if you fail go back to the drawing board); I don't care if you trade Diamonds or eggs (well I don't think eggs now--anyone know how they were traded btw?)
The reason I started trading began in the 1970's when I knew the son of an investment banker who became a broker. They lived in a 5th Ave apartment in the 70's, for those of you who know NYC. I bought some stock options and then went fishing and the Allatola started a revolution.
Quote from John47:
not to discourage, really...but here is my opinion:
There's a reason almost all good scalpers start w/ a prop firm or backed in some other way....its an edge that is possible for many people to learn profitably, but the barriers to entry are huge....i.e. fees, start up costs, and being able to weather slow months (beginning of this year, for example, was incredibly slow....just less volume and if you're a scalper that means less orders to move).
If you feel you'd like to make a living doing this I'd recommend looking for a good firm first, that'll teach you and have the necessary resources to do well, and give you a draw or some security till you make money. The product you learn to trade is arguably less important than having those things first. PS I'm a cme member, I scalp and pay $0.20 per side...I'm very consistent and make great money, but without membership I couldn't trade this edge.
Cheers
U pay just 20cents per contract per side 40cents round turn? is that with broker fees? what is the lowest cost to rent/lease a membership to get these fees?
Quote from jeb9999:
CME seat prices are listed at http://www.cmegroup.com/company/membership/membership-pricing.html
Last purchase prices are:
CME $790,000
IMM $563,000
IOM $225,000
GEM $32,500
Last monthly lease prices are:
CME $2,400
IMM $2,200
IOM $1,200
GEM $350
What is the difference between IMM/IOM/GEM? Also how much are the commissions and is the cme$2400 per month??
I used to do tons of futures scalping. It was not uncommon for me to win 10+ round trips in a row. The thing about scalping (for me atleast) is it is very high probability. You win the vast majority of trades, but you only make a small amount on each. Then the inevitable bad trade comes along and you can get caught and lose your winnings (and some principal usually).
I am convinced that futures scalping can be profitable, but its not for me. I would rather spend my time on endeavors that are scalable such as a creating a business or formulating investment ideas.
I am convinced that futures scalping can be profitable, but its not for me. I would rather spend my time on endeavors that are scalable such as a creating a business or formulating investment ideas.
Quote from boid-dog:
With TT you know from fill where you are in line (set in options menu); if you buy 23 and you are 489 of 500 and offers don't dramatically reduce your place in que you might infer that it may not go offer. If you think that you may be wrong you can pull your order and resubmit it later. Some guys place orders at distant levels before floor starts to trade in order to be first in line.
Ticks, well 3 10-yr Notes (ZN) ticks is about 1 full ES handle as fees are considerably less. Work up to 10-lot and you're in business.
I watch other instruments and though not technically arbing the principal applies. It can help me confirm and get a jump on getting in. Get to know your markets and the company they keep. 'Spreading' is also present and can often be seen in the book (TT 'pro' is designed for this purpose).
Yea, buying and selling on phone was not fun, but I did it...starting with Ag futures, NYFE, SP, (the $500 monster), OEX and don't miss it even with phone to floor.
I would emphasize again to get the facts. You have to find your own way. Even good traders don't necessarily make good teachers/mentors. In fact I won't tell my younger son "how to trade," especially when I see he has a knack for it. I could ruin it for him.
To whom ever started this Q&A (sorry i forgot who for the moment) I would emphasize that you should pretty much ignore any "advice" you get from here. If you can trade with real money that's the proof (if you fail go back to the drawing board); I don't care if you trade Diamonds or eggs (well I don't think eggs now--anyone know how they were traded btw?)
Chicago Butter and Egg exchange evolved into the MERC. Today the CME GROUP. http://www.pbs.org/itvs/openoutcry/merc.html