From CEO to pizza delivery driver

The stock market may not be a zero sum game, but short term trading like those of hedge funds is. For the stock market to be positive sum, you need to bring in the inventors and new companies. Simply merging companies, restructuring them and trading derivatives creates no prosperity.

And thus it is stupid to cheer a hedge fund manager who donates to charity. They redistribute a lot of wealth to themselves and give back a little, not impressed. they don't create anything. It's no wonder other countries don't want hedge funds!
 
Folks,

If you cant figure it out from the ridiclous name sandybestdog, shame on you if you can t figure it out from the prose-- this is a phony poster making funnies and laughing at you.

thomas the train
 
Quote from sprstpd:
I really don't get your point. Who is better, a person who owns a company and has 100 employees or a trader who donates to a non-profit organization so that they can have 100 employees? They are the same in my eyes. They are creating an opportunity that was not there before and doing an equal amount of "good."

As for zero sum games, the stock market isn't a zero sum game.

What's the difference between a person siphoning off money from people in return for clothes and a person siphoning off money from people in return for a financial instrument? Both buyers are getting something for their money and neither seller cares where that money comes from.
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A person who owns a company and employs 100 people.

The company provides a market based product or service which keeps our economy moving, the charity will artificially employ 100 people through a donation.

Again, I have no problem with people speculating, it’s a free country. But why are you people so obsessed with the false notion of trading for charity instead of fixing the problems that charity’s may or may not fix? My health insurance just went up 19%, but I didn’t get a 19% raise. So why don’t we think of a way to curb health care costs so that I don’t lose my health insurance rather than pouring money into charities to provide care for people who have lost their insurance due to its ever reaching unattainable price tag?
 
Quote from Sandybestdog:

The company provides a market based product or service which keeps our economy moving, the charity will artificially employ 100 people through a donation.
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But in the end it is the same freaking result. What, the organization donated to doesn't "keep our economy moving"? What's your deal with where the money is derived from? You obviously have some sort of bias against the financial industry. Your words, not mine.


Again, I have no problem with people speculating, it’s a free country. But why are you people so obsessed with the false notion of trading for charity instead of fixing the problems that charity’s may or may not fix? My health insurance just went up 19%, but I didn’t get a 19% raise. So why don’t we think of a way to curb health care costs so that I don’t lose my health insurance rather than pouring money into charities to provide care for people who have lost their insurance due to its ever reaching unattainable price tag?
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I never said anything like that. I'm all for curbing healthcare costs.

I just thought it strange that you think delivering pizza is somehow more important than a hedge fund trading their way to profits and then redistributing that money to charity. They are just two ways of making money, nothing more and nothing less.
 
Quote from sprstpd:

But in the end it is the same freaking result. What, the organization donated to doesn't "keep our economy moving"? What's your deal with where the money is derived from? You obviously have some sort of bias against the financial industry. Your words, not mine.



I never said anything like that. I'm all for curbing healthcare costs.

I just thought it strange that you think delivering pizza is somehow more important than a hedge fund trading their way to profits and then redistributing that money to charity. They are just two ways of making money, nothing more and nothing less.
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You say they traded their way to profits and then redistributed that money to charity. Where do you think the profits come from? You have to take it from someone. As was stated earlier by others, nothing of real value has been added, it’s just being redistributed. At least deliverying pizza is a market based service that people pay to receive.

As a soon to be former Republican, listening to people on ET, now I know why Republicans are losing so many elections. You people bash the little guy to know end and turn around and think the solution to everything is for the rich to Oh so generously open their wallets and help us poor ol people with all our little problems.

Again, can someone answer the damn question, where does the notion come from that hedge fund traders are the most heart wearming philanthropic type who win all this money so they can gave it all to charity? Then, of course, the world will be a better place, right?
 
Quote from Sandybestdog:

You say they traded their way to profits and then redistributed that money to charity. Where do you think the profits come from? You have to take it from someone. As was stated earlier by others, nothing of real value has been added, it�s just being redistributed. At least deliverying pizza is a market based service that people pay to receive.
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But that is not correct. First of all, the stock market is not a zero sum game. Second of all, I do not know who I trade against and I do not know their motives. Are they a long term investor? If so, then they hardly care that a trader might have made a little off of their transaction. They might even be grateful for the immediacy of being filled. You just don't know. What I do know is that both parties who enter a trade have reasons for entering the trade. To sit there and say that the trade has "no real value" is not truthful.


Again, can someone answer the damn question, where does the notion come from that hedge fund traders are the most heart wearming philanthropic type who win all this money so they can gave it all to charity? Then, of course, the world will be a better place, right?
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No, I never claimed that. What I did say is if someone is a talented trader then it seems ridiculous to waste that talent by purposefully choosing a different profession on the notion that trading serves no real purpose.
 
Tell that to the investors of a good hedge fund. Do mutual fund companies also add "no real value?" How is a pizza shop not just "redistributing" ingredients?
Quote from Sandybestdog:

nothing of real value has been added, it’s just being redistributed. At least deliverying pizza is a market based service that people pay to receive.
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Quote from sprstpd:

But that is not correct. First of all, the stock market is not a zero sum game. Second of all, I do not know who I trade against and I do not know their motives. Are they a long term investor? If so, then they hardly care that a trader might have made a little off of their transaction. They might even be grateful for the immediacy of being filled. You just don't know. What I do know is that both parties who enter a trade have reasons for entering the trade. To sit there and say that the trade has "no real value" is not truthful.



No, I never claimed that. What I did say is if someone is a talented trader then it seems ridiculous to waste that talent by purposefully choosing a different profession on the notion that trading serves no real purpose.
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I never said trading has no real purpose, just hedge funds like this guy was trying to set up. Global financial markets are very useful in many aspects. An airline can buy fuel months in advance so that they can accurately price their tickets. An American company does business with a German company and shorts Euros in advance to make up for currency fluctuations when they get paid. A farmer can sell his corn now that he won’t harvest for 6 months. These are all good things, but a hedge funds purpose is simply profit at any expense. So what do I care when they go bust?
 
Quote from Trader666:
Tell that to the investors of a good hedge fund. Do mutual fund companies also add "no real value?" How is a pizza shop not just "redistributing" ingredients?
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Yes redistributing and adding to. A pizza shop employs people to do a job. The food they buy employs farmers. The buildings they build employ workers. The food they transport employs truckers. The truckers pay fuel taxes that build roads. And the food they serve is paid for by people who appreciate the product they offer. It’s called an economy. Where everybody contributes something and in turn receives something. But can the same be said of a hedge fund?
 
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