Free Healthcare

[pspr]

Quote from AK Forty Seven:

Thats true luke,there was very little thinking involved

They turned the writing of the bill over to the health insurance lobbyists. That's why it's a bloated monstrosity that will make the Medicare fiasco pale in comparison. It just means we are going to be bankrupted that much sooner as it won't be long before every tax dollar goes to pay for these stupid systems that federal government has no business being involved with.

http://blog.heritage.org/2012/10/11/slideshow-obamacares-impact-in-pictures/

 

[nutmeg]

Quote from Arnie:

paying a $20 co-pay, why the hell would they have any incentive to care about costs?

I have some experiece with these $20 co pays.

If you spend a day in the hospital, every Dr that see you gets a $20 co pay. So some Dr you never heard of, don't know, stops in to say "Hi". It's $20 . You might see 3 -4 Drs a day, each one gets a co pay. Each test is a $20 co pay.

I had an outpatient visit. The test was a $20 co pay. I did not see the Dr the day of the test but he had 2 $20 co pay for that day. One to read the test and one co pay for the diagnosis. I went to see Doc two days later to get results of test - you guessed it, another co pay.

I had a surgical test. Admitted to hospital. $500 co pay. I expected a @20 co pay on surgery. Nope. Co pay is 20% of the surgery.

Some co pay procedures, for examples might be billed as 60 dollars, insurance only pays 10$ (negotiated rate) you co pay then is only $10.

Works both ways I guess.

I'm not complaining just saying, devil is in the details.

 

[nutmeg]

Oh and btw, if you got money in the bank, better talk with a financial planner on keeping your money if you ever get sick. They can tell you stories of people with > 250k in the bank and go broke, even with insurance.

I think the moral of the story is: cash in the mattress is better than cash in the bank. Maybe keep cash in the bank = liabilities.

Just sayin...

 

[bigarrow]

Quote from Arnie:

So, why not let the insurance co's charge more to people with unhealthy habits? Obamacare says they can't do that effectively. They are only allowed to charge a certain % over the median payment.

All Obamacre does is put the existing system (employer paid HC) on steroids. Get laid off, lose your HC.

The "right", as you put it, does have a better plan. Health savings accounts. I have one and used it to lower what would have cost $3,000 to $600. The only reason I did that is because I had an incentive to save since I am on the hook for the 1st $2,500 I spend each year. Look at Lasik and cosmetic surgery. Both have come down drastically in price and yet neither is covered by standard health insurance. That's the market at work. As long as you have those "fatties", again as you put it, paying a $20 co-pay, why the hell would they have any incentive to care about costs?

Many of those with unhealthy lifestyles are on government heatlth care, my idea would make everybody pay there share. LIke it or not the government in one way or another is already paying much of the health care costs. I don't see any downsides to the idea of pay as you go.
How did the Health Savings account save you $2400?

 

[bigarrow]

Quote from nutmeg:

I have some experiece with these $20 co pays.

If you spend a day in the hospital, every Dr that see you gets a $20 co pay. So some Dr you never heard of, don't know, stops in to say "Hi". It's $20 . You might see 3 -4 Drs a day, each one gets a co pay. Each test is a $20 co pay.

I had an outpatient visit. The test was a $20 co pay. I did not see the Dr the day of the test but he had 2 $20 co pay for that day. One to read the test and one co pay for the diagnosis. I went to see Doc two days later to get results of test - you guessed it, another co pay.

I had a surgical test. Admitted to hospital. $500 co pay. I expected a @20 co pay on surgery. Nope. Co pay is 20% of the surgery.

Some co pay procedures, for examples might be billed as 60 dollars, insurance only pays 10$ (negotiated rate) you co pay then is only $10.

Works both ways I guess.

I'm not complaining just saying, devil is in the details.

They are crooks, the insurance co's and the hospitals are the biggest, with some doctors coming in close behing them.

 

[AK Forty Seven]

Quote from pspr:

They turned the writing of the bill over to the health insurance lobbyists. That's why it's a bloated monstrosity that will make the Medicare fiasco pale in comparison. It just means we are going to be bankrupted that much sooner as it won't be long before every tax dollar goes to pay for these stupid systems that federal government has no business being involved with.

http://blog.heritage.org/2012/10/11/slideshow-obamacares-impact-in-pictures/

Interesting that you would link a story from the heritage foundation since Mitt got the idea for the individual mandate and insurance exchanges in Romneycare/Obamacare from them





http://www.heritage.org/research/commentary/2006/01/mitts-fit


Mitt's Fit
By Edmund F. Haislmaier
January 28, 2006




In "Unhealthy in Massachusetts" (NRO, 1/26) Sally Pipes roundly trashes Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney's health plan. However, her "just say no" critique reveals a near complete misunderstanding of the governor's innovative approach.

In reality, those who want to create a consumer-based health system and deregulate health insurance should view Romney's plan as one of the most promising strategies out there. I know, because I've been part of the Heritage Foundation team advising the governor and his staff on the design, which builds on some of my work with officials in other states.





00:29:00


<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/X61J-5sW288" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[pspr]

Quote from AK Forty Seven:

Interesting that you would link a story from the heritage foundation since Mitt got the idea for the individual mandate and insurance exchanges in Romneycare/Obamacare from them

The heritage foundation puts out a lot of good data cutting through the BS and showing what government has done to this country fiscally.

 

[trendlover]

http://www.urban.org/UploadedPDF/41...Act-Does-Much-to-Contain-Health-Care-Cost.pdf
Insurers are often more focused on strategies for gaining favorable risk selection than they are in competing based on price and quality. The exchange structure and the insurance regulation reforms included in the ACA should serve to direct insurers toward increasing the efficiency of providing care, thus lowering premium prices and increasing market share.

 

[Lucrum]

Quote from bigarrow:

...LIke it or not the government in one way or another is already paying much of the health care costs....

Government? You mean the tax payers, right?

 

[DHOHHI]

Quote from Arnie:

So, why not let the insurance co's charge more to people with unhealthy habits? Obamacare says they can't do that effectively. They are only allowed to charge a certain % over the median payment.

All Obamacre does is put the existing system (employer paid HC) on steroids. Get laid off, lose your HC.

The "right", as you put it, does have a better plan. Health savings accounts. I have one and used it to lower what would have cost $3,000 to $600. The only reason I did that is because I had an incentive to save since I am on the hook for the 1st $2,500 I spend each year. Look at Lasik and cosmetic surgery. Both have come down drastically in price and yet neither is covered by standard health insurance. That's the market at work. As long as you have those "fatties", again as you put it, paying a $20 co-pay, why the hell would they have any incentive to care about costs?

In every other form of insurance those who are poor risk and those who exhibit bad behaviors are penalized financially. Car insurance .. bad driver; higher rates or cancellation. Same with homeowners insurance .. too many claims and up go the rates or they cancel you. Why not with health insurance? With 2/3 of the country overweight or obese MANY people bring on their pre-existing conditions. People CHOOSE to eat crap food, not exercise, smoke, use drugs, drink excessively. They should pay drastically higher rates. I've been responsible for my health insurance the past 16 years as a trader. Since all premiums and expenses come out of my pocket I eat healthy, work out and do all the right things. I'm a gold mine for insurance as they pay nothing out for me and collect my premiums as if it's an ongoing annuity. Meanwhile, I subsidize all the fat lazy people who expect free, or subsidized, insurance. Fair? Nope, but if we wanted to we could fix it so people who make conscious choices to be unhealthy paid their "fair share".