Forbes: Outrageous Illinois Public Employee Salaries

[bone]

Sig, what is outrageous is that Illinois has no way of actually paying for these pensions. The State has been downgraded 21 times since 2009, and this is all driven by the pension crisis. The answer from Illinois politicians continues to be more tax hikes. But Illinois is losing residents and businesses at an alarming rate.

You talk about what is a fair wage. The Illinois Policy Institute claims that Illinois State Workers are the highest paid State workers in the US when adjusted for each State's Cost-of-living Index. https://www.illinoispolicy.org/reports/illinois-state-workers-highest-paid-in-nation/

I personally have absolutely NO problem with the average Illinois State worker pay level of $59K. But if you want to continue with your assertion that paying School District Superintendents $330K per year and small local government executives and small town managers $250K per year is necessary - I would strongly beg to differ.

I pulled this from an October 2019 article from the Chicago Tribune: "Real estate professionals like Tom Keefe, owner of Keefe Real Estate in Lake Geneva, Wisconsin, have noticed an influx of Chicago residents moving to The Badger State for a number of reasons, but the lower tax burden seems to trump them all.

“For the same size house in Illinois, taxes are triple and quadruple what they are in Wisconsin. And a lot of people think the services here are just as good, if not better, particularly when it comes to schooling,” he said."

In what universe is $100,000 a year some outrageous salary that should be utterly verboten for any public employee? Heck, that's a starting salary for a bunch of fields. Most military officers cross $100K at just past the 10 year mark unless they're living in govt housing, and yet pretty much every one of us got a major pay raise when we got out indicating that we were underpaid relative to our skill level...should we all be outraged that we're paying military folks that much despite the fact that apparently the market thinks they're worth more?

Get real people, it's not the 1950s any more! Over 14 million Americans make over $100K a year, it's not some outrageous salary that should lead to this kind of outrage. And no, the benefits of working for the government aren't worth nearly what you're all making them out to be, most could be replicated for not a lot.

And honestly, how many of you getting apoplectic about this also complain about all public service employees being stupid and worthless? Do you honestly expect that you should be able to pay a group of people crap and then somehow expect the best and brightest to go take those jobs?

Certainly there are some issues with public sector benefits, specifically the practice that is still ensconced in many union contracts of basing retirement on high 1, 2, or 3 and including overtime in those high years. But arbitrarily deciding that $100K a year is an outrage...is itself a bit of an outrage.

 

[Sig]

Sig, what is outrageous is that Illinois has no way of actually paying for these pensions. The State has been downgraded 21 times since 2009, and this is all driven by the pension crisis. The answer from Illinois politicians continues to be more tax hikes. But Illinois is losing residents and businesses at an alarming rate.

You talk about what is a fair wage. The Illinois Policy Institute claims that Illinois State Workers are the highest paid State workers in the US when adjusted for each State's Cost-of-living Index. https://www.illinoispolicy.org/reports/illinois-state-workers-highest-paid-in-nation/

I personally have absolutely NO problem with the average Illinois State worker pay level of $59K. But if you want to continue with your assertion that paying School District Superintendents $330K per year and small local government executives and small town managers $250K per year is necessary - I would strongly beg to differ.

I pulled this from an October 2019 article from the Chicago Tribune: "Real estate professionals like Tom Keefe, owner of Keefe Real Estate in Lake Geneva, Wisconsin, have noticed an influx of Chicago residents moving to The Badger State for a number of reasons, but the lower tax burden seems to trump them all.

“For the same size house in Illinois, taxes are triple and quadruple what they are in Wisconsin. And a lot of people think the services here are just as good, if not better, particularly when it comes to schooling,” he said."

So a school district superintendent is tasked with 75-100,000 students, around 5,000 teachers and a couple thousand other employees, and a budget north of a billion dollars a year. I make a hell of a lot more than they do, and I'm responsible for far far less on every metric. Someone tasked with that level of responsibility at any private sector company would certainly be making north of that, heck most of the full professors at my grad school university were at that level and they just had the PhD and a fraction of the responsibility. Can IL pay for it or not is a valid question, but I don't think it's at all an unrealistic salary given the level of the job.

As I think we've discussed before, it's important to realize that pension tails come from being one of the major drivers of U.S. GDP for the past 100 years. FL doesn't don't have them, for example, not necessarily because they're so much better at controlling cost but because when all the folks in IL now earning pensions were cranking out GDP, FL was cranking out oranges and not much else. It's more a case of the boomers not paying into the pensions and screwing us as they did with everything else than the pensions themselves being unreasonable (aside from the overtime trick that I think is BS).

 

[piezoe]

Thought it was just the way it was? Here in Canada I have one friend whose a civil engineer in the private sector and another friend drives garbage truck for the city, who would you think makes more?

Unions treat the provincial and federal coffers like endless piggy banks. Every year more raises and benefits.

Know my wife as a nurse was telling me about her less agreement. She thought it was good. Think it was 2% a year and a few other benefits. All her co-workers basically said they’d vote no because what’s the worst case scenario.

Private sector couldn’t even ever come close to these ludicrous pensions.

There is a simple solution to this problem. Suggest to your civil engineer friend that he try to get a job as a garbage truck driver. That way he can make more money.

 

[piezoe]

Not sure why you compare public sector white collar work to private sector blue collar work. Just as many worthless paper pushers in the private sector and white collar work often pays better no matter your sector.

Heck I sit behind a desk, send emails and meetings all day. It's my job running the company I built from nothing. I kind of bristle at the Maoist idea that because I'm not sweating my work is worth less.

Probably thinking should count for at least something. Is thinking becoming passe'?

 

[BAT31]

I shudder think what many of these employees do in an eight hour day. I suspect a typical goes like this:

9:30 - 10:00: Arrive at work an hour late.

10:00 - 11:00: Check org email, check social media messages, reply to both.

11:00 - 1:00: Lunch.

1:00 - 2:00: Attend org meetings.

2:00 - 3:00: Read and reply to org emails, and social media messages.

3:00 - 3:30: Break.

3:30 - 4:00: Read and reply to org emails, and social media message.

4:00: Leave for the day to beat rush hour traffic.

How can I get one of those sweet Illinois state jobs?

 

[Sig]

I shudder think what many of these employees do in an eight hour day. I suspect a typical goes like this:

9:30 - 10:00: Arrive at work an hour late.

10:00 - 11:00: Check org email, check social media messages, reply to both.

11:00 - 1:00: Lunch.

1:00 - 2:00: Attend org meetings.

2:00 - 3:00: Read and reply to org emails, and social media messages.

3:00 - 3:30: Break.

3:30 - 4:00: Read and reply to org emails, and social media message.

4:00: Leave for the day to beat rush hour traffic.

How can I get one of those sweet Illinois state jobs?

Again, do you seriously think the schoold superintendent tasked with 75-100,000 students, around 5,000 teachers and a couple thousand other employees, and a budget north of a billion dollars a year is doing anything like that? I mean seriously, did you just pull all that out your ass then convince yourself that it was somehow fact because you had written it down?

 

[SunTrader]

Meanwhile years ago Boeing moved their HQ to Illinois from state of Washington.

CEO during 737 Max debacle was shown the door but not before he walked away into retirement with $28+ million.

Public private same difference. And before anyone says public is taxpayer money. We, all of us, pay for the incompetence, greed and fraud of others wherever it takes place.

 

[Metamega]

There is a simple solution to this problem. Suggest to your civil engineer friend that he try to get a job as a garbage truck driver. That way he can make more money.

They won't let you in. It's all family and friends watching each others back. Not like you can argue over whose qualifications are better in an interview.

 

[BAT31]

Again, do you seriously think the schoold superintendent tasked with 75-100,000 students, around 5,000 teachers and a couple thousand other employees, and a budget north of a billion dollars a year is doing anything like that? I mean seriously, did you just pull all that out your ass then convince yourself that it was somehow fact because you had written it down?

Of course not. There is a bit of sarcasm in my post. However, there is some truth in sarcasm. Do you think if auditors observed anonymously, they wouldn't find a couple of instances of what I wrote?

 

[Sig]

Of course not. There is a bit of sarcasm in my post. However, there is some truth in sarcasm. Do you think if auditors observed anonymously, they wouldn't find a couple of instances of what I wrote?

Absolutely. As they would at any corporation in America (or anywhere else in the world for that matter)