Fidelity crypto trading

[M.W.]

I don't think anyone compared the fees to brokerages that charge no commission but variable spreads. I would tend to agree with you if that was the benchmark. I compared it with how much my local bank charges for a wire transfer to anywhere in the world I wish to transfer funds to. Or brokers for executions with direct market access where you pay the actually market determined spread, only.

On the other hand, it is equally disingenuous to just look at crypto to crypto transfer fees either. As long as bread and milk is still being paid with fiat one needs to account for all the fees to get your cryptos purchased with fiat and the other way around as well and those total cost are far exceeding any cost most banks charge for fiat money transfers. Same applies to trading cryptos: fees to convert fiat to crypto, transfer fees from crypto1 to crypto2, transfer fees between cold storage and exchange wallets,and many other fees.

I really don't like this marketing game that these brokerages have been doing for quite a while by calling a trade "commission-free" but then still taking a cut out of the trade by up-charging the customer by giving them an inferior execution price. It just seems like a play on words because they are still getting a fee for facilitating the trade. So it's not a "commission" simply because they aren't calling it one? And with them fiddling around with the spread in a variable way up to 1%, it just seems very um... I hate to use the word shady... but it definitely doesn't seem like a clear and transparent way to do business from the perspective of the customer.

 

[GlobalMacro90]

It's completely irrelevant to distinguish between the two. It's as if I stated that inherently options trading is free, it's just those exchanges and brokers and clearing houses and middle men who take their cut.

Fact is that nothing so far in cryptoland is cheaper than transferring money the old fiat way. And I have forever said that it won't ever get cheaper because there will always be third parties that weave themselves into the crypto fabric which need to recover hundreds of millions in investments and advertising to make themselves relevant. They will always take such a huge bite out of the apple that fees will not be lower than current transfer and payment fees.

Bitcoins value proposition is to create a true peer to peer value transfer Netwerk that always works, relies on nobody, can’t be shut off, can’t be censored, can’t be seized etc. so of course the bitcoin fees for peer-to-peer transactions is very important for long-term adoption. Your lack of knowledge about this whole thing is a literally shocking maybe you should just shut the fuck up.

 

[tiddlywinks]

Bitcoins value proposition is to create a true peer to peer value transfer Netwerk that always works, relies on nobody, can’t be shut off, can’t be censored, can’t be seized etc. so of course the bitcoin fees for peer-to-peer transactions is very important for long-term adoption. ...

I am no expert by any stretch, but every one of your bullet points is easily rebutted, and for the most part, have been proven as a fail in practice.

I think that making crypto purchases and custody simpler for the masses will be the key to crypto being more acceptable in the future for sure. Things are not quite there yet, but they are headed in the right direction.

On this we agree. Common ground has been found!!

 

[M.W.]

And it has been well established by now that nothing other than the base blockchain works. All else is up for grabs by hacks, criminals, the mafia, white collar criminals, corporate graft. Once this space gets regulated your peer to peer will go away, you anonymity will go away, you will end up with a centrally managed chain that replaces fiat but in essence is the exact same than fiat when it comes to monetary policy, just that it is now in digital rather than paper Form. And that is what every western government currently works towards in order to catch up with China which already runs its currency on the blockchain. In effect we will lose our freedom over our finances and our entire liquid wealth can be frozen overnight.

Of course you will be 200 forums away by the time this happens and won't be able to come back here to admit I was right all along.

Bitcoins value proposition is to create a true peer to peer value transfer Netwerk that always works, relies on nobody, can’t be shut off, can’t be censored, can’t be seized etc. so of course the bitcoin fees for peer-to-peer transactions is very important for long-term adoption. Your lack of knowledge about this whole thing is a literally shocking maybe you should just shut the fuck up.

 

[GlobalMacro90]

The bitcoin Netwerk was never hacked at the base layer only custodians and exchanges. You physically can’t stop a transaction so censorship is impossible. The Netwerk has had zero downtime in 12 years. Please tell me where I am wrong about any of this and if it’s so easy to refute why don’t you try to refute it

 

[Frederick Foresight]

The 1% spread is prohibitive for actual trading. But if you are thinking of investing and putting money in every month or quarterly and you are hoping for gazillion % returns, then that is an acceptable fee for convenience of not dealing with wallets and offshore exchanges.

Is it?

"Mind your pennies and the dollars will take care of themselves."

 

[Frederick Foresight]

I think that making crypto purchases and custody simpler for the masses will be the key to crypto being more acceptable in the future for sure. Things are not quite there yet, but they are headed in the right direction.

That's one way of putting it. The other is that it will hasten the inevitable.

 

[Pekelo]

Is it?

You have to realize most people don't understand crypto and never will. Setting up a wallet is not that obvious, so yes, for INVESTING and hoping for 1-200% return, an in and out fee of 2% is nothing.

Not to mention the dealing with crypto exchanges when your own Fidelity can do the same without transferring money, opening accounts, trusting a shady guy,etc....

 

[Frederick Foresight]

You have to realize most people don't understand crypto and never will. Setting up a wallet is not that obvious, so yes, for INVESTING and hoping for 1-200% return, an in and out fee of 2% is nothing.

Not to mention the dealing with crypto exchanges when your own Fidelity can do the same without transferring money, opening accounts, trusting a shady guy,etc....

Yeah, it's easy to charge outrageous rates when brokers are selling visions of sugar cookies.

 

[M.W.]

How did you get any bitcoin in the first place? You had to exchange your fiat at some point. Those are the nodes that are all exposed to hackers and corporate criminals. So just stating that the base blockchain has not been hacked is dishonest. It's a small fraction of the entire equation.

The bitcoin Netwerk was never hacked at the base layer only custodians and exchanges. You physically can’t stop a transaction so censorship is impossible. The Netwerk has had zero downtime in 12 years. Please tell me where I am wrong about any of this and if it’s so easy to refute why don’t you try to refute it