Ex-Hawaii official denounces 'ludicrous' birther claims.

[Pekelo]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:

I think it has to do with sadness of losing someone you love, be it a parent, child, wife, etc.

Well, my approach is (would be) different. Why would you be losing the dying person when he/she simply just moving into a different place where they eventually gonna meet again? Isn't that some kind of selfishness? For the dying the afterlife is (supposedly) definitely a better place. What is a few decades compared to eternity? In some cultures there is actually a religious CELEBRATION when the person dies, and that makse way more sense to me...

And when the dying person is old and/or sick, let just him/her go. That's why I don't get the Christian standpoint on euthanasia, but we are getting seriously offtopic here...

 

[stu]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:
Doubt is natural and a product of the intellect that can doubt everything but it self....

Faith is not the absence of doubt, but a decision to believe in something greater than the intellectual doubts. Just like the courageous keep moving forward in the face of fear, the faithful keep moving forward in the face of doubt.

Whether it's chicken bones or a deity, putting faith in superstition is essentially a means to avoid doubt, a way to not address actual circumstances where true courage may be born.
Doubt provides objectivity and is the basis for enquiry led knowledge.

But in the face of doubt, the faithful are supposed to be down on their knees with eyes shut.
Apparently to keep moving forward, but in faith, which fundamentally is to doubt doubt itself.

Quote from trefoil:
One state recognizing the citizenship status of another state's citizens isn't "pinko website fiction". It's in the Constitution, and it's there for the very simple reason that without it, you don't have a nation. If you don't get that, you have no business whatsoever commenting on this issue.

Yet still there is Creationism, Birtherism and other fantasies. Even when a Universe's short form scientific birth certificate and a President's Hawaiian one would be normally considered worthy enough in their own right.

 

[Ricter]

Quote from stu:

Whether it's chicken bones or a deity, putting faith in superstition is essentially a means to avoid doubt, a way to not address actual circumstances where true courage may be born.
Doubt provides objectivity and is the basis for enquiry led knowledge.

Are you quite certain on this?

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from jem:

at least you would also agree.. there is no evidence of what reality is after we die. right? or do you have faith in nothing?

here is a clue for you. humans are higher evolved animals. is there a heaven for animals?

 

[RCG Trader]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:

"and they define it as say two american parents and born in america"

...and there is the rub, because it is clear that the states do not have the ability or right to determine what is Federal law. You have stated it is a Federal issue here:

"Citizenship of the United States is determined by federal law and governed by the constitution of the United States."

So a state can be stupid, and pass a stupid law that will go immediately to a federal judge who will place a temporary stay on the state law...just like the federal courts did with the Arizona immigration law.

You agree that this cannot be decided by the states, simply because they don't have the power or right to decide what is the federal Constitutional requirements.

So let a stupid state pass a stupid law, and get squashed immediately, and have this work its way to the Supreme Court, who will make a ruling that will establish what the rule of law is by their interpretation of what is the necessary proof for the designation of a natural born citizen.

I think the birthers are going to get creamed on this one, and it will come back to bite them.

I could be wrong of course, but the odds favor a sitting president over the chaos that would result from a barbaric decision on a political basis.

The birther argument is silly. Glenn Beck of ALL the people in the world even says stop with the birther thing. It makes the GOP, especially conservatives, look retarded.

The birther thing is so retarded that clinically it is actually a reaction formation. An American black man is President. This flies in face of what some believe to be a "real" American. It is a form of trauma, and it is fascinating to watch. First they try to emasculate him, which goes to the heart of a whole other topic, then they try to say he is not a "real" American.

It is an amazing thing to watch play out here in the microcosm that is ET. I would love to get a detailed demographic analysis of some of these folks.

 

[stu]

Quote from Ricter:

Are you quite certain on this?

Quite certain, to a point, then uncertain, where faith starts to suspend doubt.

 

[OPTIONAL777]

<img src=http://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/Images/try_this/spinning_top.gif>

Quote from stu:

Quite certain, to a point, then uncertain, where faith starts to suspend doubt.

 

[OPTIONAL777]

You have faith in atheism...that's a fact. It is a necessary fact to maintain a disbelief in God for the atheist. They must ridicule the concept of God in order to maintain their belief in non God.

Sorry, but you are just the flip side of the same coin...

Quote from stu:

Whether it's chicken bones or a deity, putting faith in superstition is essentially a means to avoid doubt, a way to not address actual circumstances where true courage may be born.
Doubt provides objectivity and is the basis for enquiry led knowledge.

But in the face of doubt, the faithful are supposed to be down on their knees with eyes shut.
Apparently to keep moving forward, but in faith, which fundamentally is to doubt doubt itself.


Yet still there is Creationism, Birtherism and other fantasies. Even when a Universe's short form scientific birth certificate and a President's Hawaiian one would be normally considered worthy enough in their own right.

 

[OPTIONAL777]

You have your approach, others have theirs, apparently you think your approach is superior.

I suspect that if you had a dog you loved, and the dog died, you would miss the company of your dog.

What to say of the love for a child for a parent and vice versa?

Perhaps you have never deeply loved...

Again, the grieving is not for the person who is gone...but the grieving is about the person who has lost a loved one and misses them.

Quote from Pekelo:

Well, my approach is (would be) different. Why would you be losing the dying person when he/she simply just moving into a different place where they eventually gonna meet again? Isn't that some kind of selfishness? For the dying the afterlife is (supposedly) definitely a better place. What is a few decades compared to eternity? In some cultures there is actually a religious CELEBRATION when the person dies, and that makse way more sense to me...

And when the dying person is old and/or sick, let just him/her go. That's why I don't get the Christian standpoint on euthanasia, but we are getting seriously offtopic here...

 

[jem]

Quote from Free Thinker:

here is a clue for you. humans are higher evolved animals. is there a heaven for animals?

good question. If we hold the bible teachings aside....

I am confident time is an illusion. I suspect this whole idea of space and universe is very limited. So I really have no idea how to take what I observe in a very limited manner and cast big judgments about something I have zero knowlege of.