Ex Dutch Prime Minister: USA is a rogue state

Quote from TigerO:

lol, particularly places that had nothing, zilch, nada to do with international terror until we invaded them for totally cooked up reasons, diverting limited resources from what should have been the number one priority, fighting international terror and it's causes, but which unfortunately was neglected because we just happen to have a bunch of deranged, corrupt and incredibly dangerous Neo-Con nutters who have hijacked this country.
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The "causes" behind terror? What, that baby Osama didn't get enough love from his mommy?

Are you really that hopelessly niaive? Does the fact honestly escape you that THEY WAN'T US DEAD? Not just a few of us, mind you. Not even thousands. But every last one of us. And all the hand holding, big hugs and kumbaya-ing won't change the fact that they will not stop until that goal is achieved.

There is thus no reasoning with them. There is no negotiation or "peaceful coexistance". And a failure to fight back with the same ruthless goal in mind will be perceived by them as a sign of weakness that will only encourage further acts of terror.

But I really don't know why I waste my time with the likes of you. I know your type. You sit in the safety of your little world all day long smugly typing your moronic missives and chatting with your equally confused friends, all while protected by the courage and sacrifice of those for whom you have only contempt.

Hence, there is obviously nothing I or anyone else could say that will get through your misguided myopia. Rather, I suspect the only thing that would do the trick would be a suicide bomb outside your door. So until then, please prattle on with your idiocy.
 
Quote from Hello_Dollars:

There is thus no reasoning with them.
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That's the crux - who are "they"? Because what worries us is that "they" are very, very obviously not the vast majority of the population of Iraq, Palestine, or even Afghanistan.

I absolutely, wholeheartedly, 100% agree with you that if we as military western powers could identify terrorist targets we should attack them with devastating and irresistable force. My disagreement with you is that I do not believe that that is what we are doing.

No doubt there are terrorists in Iraq. There are also terrorists in Saudi Arabia, in Spain, in Britain. Even in America. The tools we are using are not the right ones for the job that we are confronted with. In fact, by using military force indiscriminately against large targets we will create the kind of resentment and hatred that causes terrorism against the wetsern world, especially but not only America, in the first place.

Look at Iraq now. Whatever you think about Saddam Hussain (a truly evil man who no-one is sad to see the back of), Iraq was previously a secular country. Now it looks likely to be taken over by religious leaders (or remain occupied indefinitely). Surely that isn't what you wanted to see when we invaded?

The fact is that the population of Iraq didn't celebrate the arrival of democracy via the armies of the USA and UK. I think they're wrong, you'd have to be mad to prefer being an Iraqi to an American, but there you go. What do you do now? Keep hitting them until they admit that you're right? Because it just isn't going to happen. It hasn't happened in Palestine, in Chechnya or in Northern Ireland. It just breeds resentment and hatred, which breed terrorism.
 
There always are and always will be evil nutters like Bush or Bin Laden, nothing can prevent that. :D

Believing anything else is naive.

People like that just have be uncovered and brought to justice with some effective intelligence work, like eg with Carlos etc, which in turn necessitates international cooperation, the latter unfortunately being another thing that Bush has pretty much destroyed where the US is concerned. (Just remember all the tremendous international good will we had after 9-11, that he managed to squash in less than one year)

Fighting the leaders is one thing, combating the causes of terror is obviously an equally important thing you need to do to dry up the wave of new recruits willing to die for a grievance or an injustice, which creates hatred, and leads to violence and terror.

Like working on an equitable solution for the Israel / Palestine situation, which in itself is a prime cause of terror that Bush has first totally neglected, and now he's supporting a totally unjust and half assed plan that will only serve to dramatically exacerbate the situation, and that has very clearly demonstrated to the Arab world that we are not the honest broker we pretended we are.

Bush has done absolutely nothing to fight terror by invading a country that posed no threat to us, was not behind 9-11, and had no links to international terror, until we invaded, that is, no, he has merely created a huge new wave if not generation of terrorists and given them good cause to plot against us.

We reap what we sow.

Simple as that.
 
Quote from msfe:

exactly ...
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Clever. Now here's another one for you. Just take the words "the complete antithesis of" out of the following and repost:

msfe, your contributions to the board are the complete antithesis of witty, intelligent, insightful and eagerly received.

You're welcome, genius.
 
ov11_gnothi_sauton_kl.GIF
 
First, I did not intend to sound as condescending as it came off when I said 'still not paying attention.'

However...

Second, that had to be the best non-stop rip of a post I have ever read. The fact that it was my head you felt like ripping off didn't matter by the time I was done reading it. kudos.

Third, not too many Yanks actually know what the hell a wanker really is. It wasn't until one of the SAS boys that prowled the Saudi/Kuwaiti desert with us excused himself so he could unashamedly 'go have a wank' that I even knew.

So excuse 'grandad' here. Gotta go have a wank.
 
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