Evolution debunked in 1 paragraph.

[trendlover]

Quote from tomdavis:

Interesting article. I especially liked this quote: "Students should be told about evidence and how scientists reached their conclusions, not whether scientists "believe" something or how many do or don't."

Quote from Lucrum:

Yeah I emphasized that excerpt earlier. Of course to the anti God/creator fanatics this IS a major part of their argument, so naturally they ignored it.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


This same man question (macroevolution), then he say this:


"In closing, it is worth noting that despite the impression one gets from the media and extremists on both sides of the issue, a proof of the theory of evolution, even in most of its macroevolutionary forms, would not disprove the existence of a Creator God. One knows, for example, that the God of the Bible often uses means in addition to miracles to accomplish his ends. Thus the demonstration of a "naturalistic" mechanism does not in itself exclude a Designer who uses that mechanism as a tool to achieve his purposes."


You see? He (believe) in miracles = designer?
Lucrum, this man is saying he want students to know how scientists come to conclusions for the natural world. Then he talk about people have to (believe) miracles? And he want to teach that?
Look what he is saying here:

"Evangelicals have been challenged in numerous areas by science. We should not fear
that real discoveries will overthrow biblical Christianity, nor should we treat science as an
enemy. Instead we should realize that science is in the process of studying general
revelation. God will continue to reveal himself to scientists as long as they do not
overextend their methodology so as to rule out God or refuse to consider the possibility that
he has intervened miraculously into nature."


http://www.newmanlib.ibri.org/Documents/EvangsModSci.pdf

 

[tomdavis]

Personally, I believe the evidence in favor of evolution is strong. But it's really just a sideshow in our failing education system.

I've got two kids in school and evolution is perhaps 3% of the curriculum. It's a minor issue. I'm much more concerned that kids are graduating from high school who can't read a book, write a simple memo or do basic math. Our education system is trainwreck. The issue of teaching evolution pales in comparison to the real problems.

Quote from Gabfly1:

If that precept was genuinely adhered to in the schools that would otherwise propose to teach it, then the idea of creationism as a purported "scientific theory" would already be dead, buried and forgotten.

 

[TGregg]

Quote from tomdavis:

I've got two kids in school and evolution is perhaps 3% of the curriculum. It's a minor issue. I'm much more concerned that kids are graduating from high school who can't read a book, write a simple memo or do basic math. Our education system is trainwreck. The issue of teaching evolution pales in comparison to the real problems.

Funny that the last post (last post I can read thanks to my MASSIVE ignore list) is a valid point. Like the poster above, I am not superstitious. Probably like the poster above I would take issue with swearing an oath on a bible in a court of law.

But these are tiny issues.

No one cares.

Fight the good fight, not this crap.

 

[shortie]

"What just happened here was a f*cking miracle!"

 

[stu]

Quote from tomdavis:

Personally, I believe the evidence in favor of evolution is strong. But it's really just a sideshow in our failing education system.

I've got two kids in school and evolution is perhaps 3% of the curriculum. It's a minor issue. I'm much more concerned that kids are graduating from high school who can't read a book, write a simple memo or do basic math. Our education system is trainwreck. The issue of teaching evolution pales in comparison to the real problems.

One of the most continuously and heavily researched scientific explanations for life on earth and you think it's a minor issue ?
Rest assured the complacency you display for your kids education will be taken full advantage of by the rest of the developed world including China too.
Failed science, failed math , failed reading, failed writing. All can be called sideshows in the same trainwreck.

 

[stu]

 

[Gabfly1]

Quote from stu:

Another keeper. Keep 'em coming.

 

[tomdavis]

For some strange reason, you seem to think that I'm defending creationism. I'm not. In my previous post I stated CLEARLY that I believe the evidence supports evolution.

On the 3rd page of this thread, in response to the OP, I stated the following: "Have you ever taken a science class? Have you ever taken a statistics class? If you had, you would understand how ridiculous (aka, ignorant) your statement is."

It's bizarre that despite my posts to the contrary, you insinuate that I don't believe in evolution. While I did acknowledge that a particular post was "interesting" and that I agreed with one quote, at no point did I ever say that I agreed with creationism. I invite you to go back and re-read the first post I made on this thread if my opinion on this subject isn't clear. http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=222418&perpage=6&pagenumber=3

Back to the larger point I was making: In most public schools it doesn't matter what they teach because the kids aren't learning anything. In southern California, 40% drop-out rates are common in public schools. Most of those that do graduate have minimal reading skills and virtually no math or science skills. Only about 20% are prepared for college. Accepting or not accepting evolution does not determine whether a child learns to read or do math or phsyics. Yes, it would be nice if everyone accepted evolutionary science, but it's not the core problem facing our schools. It's not even close to the top of the list.

Regarding my alleged complacency: My children attend one of the best private schools in the country. 100% of the graduates go on to college and 25% get accepted to Ivy League schools (my 13 year-old already has her eye on Yale). Next summer we'll be making a trip back east to visit the campus. Perhaps you consider that complacency on my part. If so, we can agree to disagree.

Quote from stu:

One of the most continuously and heavily researched scientific explanations for life on earth and you think it's a minor issue ?

Rest assured the complacency you display for your kids education will be taken full advantage of by the rest of the developed world including China too.

Failed science, failed math , failed reading, failed writing. All can be called sideshows in the same trainwreck.

 

[stu]

Quote from tomdavis:

For some strange reason, you seem to think that I'm defending creationism. I'm not. In my previous post I stated CLEARLY that I believe the evidence supports evolution.

On the 3rd page of this thread, in response to the OP, I stated the following: "Have you ever taken a science class? Have you ever taken a statistics class? If you had, you would understand how ridiculous (aka, ignorant) your statement is."

It's bizarre that despite my posts to the contrary, you insinuate that I don't believe in evolution. While I did acknowledge that a particular post was "interesting" and that I agreed with one quote, at no point did I ever say that I agreed with creationism. I invite you to go back and re-read the first post I made on this thread if my opinion on this subject isn't clear. http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=222418&perpage=6&pagenumber=3

Back to the larger point I was making: In most public schools it doesn't matter what they teach because the kids aren't learning anything. In southern California, 40% drop-out rates are common in public schools. Most of those that do graduate have minimal reading skills and virtually no math or science skills. Only about 20% are prepared for college. Accepting or not accepting evolution does not determine whether a child learns to read or do math or phsyics. Yes, it would be nice if everyone accepted evolutionary science, but it's not the core problem facing our schools. It's not even close to the top of the list.

Regarding my alleged complacency: My children attend one of the best private schools in the country. 100% of the graduates go on to college and 25% get accepted to Ivy League schools (my 13 year-old already has her eye on Yale). Next summer we'll be making a trip back east to visit the campus. Perhaps you consider that complacency on my part. If so, we can agree to disagree.

In regards to you being in support of creationism, I did neither suggest nor insinuate anything of the kind. Perhaps you could be specific in where you think I did.

In regard to your main point, my earlier remarks, to which you must be assuming for some reason I thought of you as supporting creationism, which I do not , is like suggesting whether kids do or do not learn division, does not determine whether a child learns mathematics.
Of course it matters in science that they learn the principles behind evolution, just as it is to learn the principles behind sentence formation when learning to read and write.

It is in my opinion complacent of you and a dumbing down, to be content in removing essential parts of a curriculum like evolution for instance, just to argue by it, that there then may be a chance kids could at least speak or perhaps even print when they leave public school, which aside from doing them terrible injustice, is leaving them susceptible to all sorts of ignorance.
Like creationism.

 

[tomdavis]

Where did I ever suggest that evolution should be "removed?" I was making the point that kids aren't learning much of anything. Fifty percent of high school graduates don't know who Isaac Newton was, and an equal number can't find England on map. Do you expect them to even begin to grasp evolutionary science?

Do you have kids in public schools? Do you teach? Do you have any exposure on a day-to-day basis of what's going on in public schools?

After many years of experience, I can tell you that the issues you point to are symptoms, not problems. The underlying probems are with the competing agendas of teachers, unions, administrators, parents and students. Until that core problem is solved, our education system will continue to slide down hill. That's why we took our kids out of public schools and put them into private schools.

Quote from stu:

In regards to you being in support of creationism, I did neither suggest nor insinuate anything of the kind. Perhaps you could be specific in where you think I did.

In regard to your main point, my earlier remarks, to which you must be assuming for some reason I thought of you as supporting creationism, which I do not , is like suggesting whether kids do or do not learn division does not determine whether a child learns mathematics.
Of course it matters in science that they learn the principles behind evolution just as it is to learn the principles in sentence formation in when learning to read and write.

It is in my opinion complacent of you and a dumbing down, to be content in removing essential parts of a curriculum like evolution for instance, just to argue by it, that there may be a chance kids could at least speak or perhaps even print as acceptable when they leave public school, leaving then susceptible to all sorts of ignorance.
Like creationism.