Eurodollar Futures (GE)--anyone else trading these?

[trdinglife]

Quote from FredBloggs:

im not sure i get this. taking m6-m5 (june not march ) is hedging. i see it better for a position trade due to the reduced margin - and so more size i can afford.

as you say, m5 dont move much so i will be giving up a tick or 2 in total profit (if any!!!) for twice the size over a longer term time horizon.

im no expert in this either though! im playing small until i sort it out for good. like u say - i need to study the individual legs and spreads more.

cheers bloggs...I understand your point...I guess our timeframes differ so our considerations of margin and risk differ...

 

[dunleggin]

Quote from Acidjazz:

Thanks, tried to access the article, but can't, have u got a copy.

I wish....unfortunately I've yet to find a kind insider or client who can provide GCM's research. On a couple of occasions I have picked up a profitable trading idea merely from those Front Page teaser quotes, though.

 

[dunleggin]

Quote from suntzu:


Thanks for the link to RBS Greenwich. Unfortunately i don't have a password. Only managed to read that one sentence that ED 1yr butterflies are all rich. Do you have the gist of his commentary?

Sorry, see my reply to AcidJazz

Quote from suntzu:

I compared the EDZ05H06 spread with the narrowing of the 2-10 yr spread since June 2004 and its pretty much gone the same way. The z05h06 spread has narrowed from 28 pts then to 10.5 today

Z05H06 sector is not the same point on the ED curve now as it was back in Jun '04, though?

 

[Acidjazz]

Quote from suntzu:

Forgive my ignorance. Who's old Goldie?

Thanks for feedback. It appears to me that if curve steepening comes back in vogue, the Z05 and H06 contracts will be the key months to be long.

Front spreads finally narrowed. Gosh its been a while. Finally managed to buy back the U05Z05H06 fly at 6.5. Its been a 2-3 week wait.

I'm thinking of less commission intensive ways of trading EDs.

Can I ask outright ED traders, how do you guys trade the outrights?

Suntzu,

Why do u want to trade outrights, I assume u made money on ur flys, given the risk profile (very little, a significantly reduced margin), surely the returns must have been very decent. Commision intensive ? am I right in thinking that 1 tick covered ur costs, so whats the problem.
Trading outrights while also very profitable if u have a good system, does have a different risk profile. Waiting 2 - 4 wks for a decent profit with a reduced risk profile seems acceptable, but hey what do I know, just my 2 cents worth

 

[suntzu]

Quote from dsguns1:

well....If it looks like its going up, BUY IT. And if it looksl ike its going down, SEL SELL SELL!!!!!!
Dont be a fool and ask people who have put there hard earned time, risk, and money behind finding a way to make money trading about how they do it. And anybody that is willing to give up their information is nothing better than a blithering ninny.
Answer to your question: put your balls up and FIGURE IT OUT!!!!

dsguns1,

I'd heard about guys in the forum like yourself. Why, you still struggling to make a dime in the ED markets? The market's got you so dazed and confused you can't tell your left ball from your right?

Nobody's asking for trade secrets. I'd just like to listen to some other ED traders experience which might be very different from mine.

This thread's been fabulous thus far. Don't wreck it.

 

[suntzu]

Quote from trdinglife:

Goldie=Goldman...just my own ad-libbing...just meaning that he was big seller of Sep05 and may have been buying Dec05 as a flattener unwind...

as for outright trading, while I agree somewhat with ds and his outburst, I think I could be a little more diplomatic about it...so what exactly do you mean 'how' do we trade outrights?

trdinglife,

Thank you for being diplomatic.

I'm Singaporean and Chinese. It's our culture to be humble and I try to learn as much as I can from others.

I'm just trying to figure out different ways of trading the ED. I been trading ED flies for the past 6 years and am curious to learn new methods. Thus I'm experimenting with outright trading.

Right now if I try to scalp EDs, I look at the 10 yr bond and S&P futures for direction. I'm just wondering what other indicators might be useful for scalping that I haven't taken note of.

Cheers.

 

[dsguns1]

Quote from suntzu:

dsguns1,

I'd heard about guys in the forum like yourself. Why, you still struggling to make a dime in the ED markets? The market's got you so dazed and confused you can't tell your left ball from your right?

Nobody's asking for trade secrets. I'd just like to listen to some other ED traders experience which might be very different from mine.

This thread's been fabulous thus far. Don't wreck it.

Exactly, this is a great forum. However, to ask someone how they make their money in the ED is truly not right. I cant really understand why I should give my ideas to someone else? I trade 200 at a time as outrights, why should I tell someone what I see or do so they can go after the same thing that I am??????? Really, dont use your "culture" as an excuse to bilk free info. Again, it took me alot of trial and error to become a consistent trader. Trading is not a group sport, at the end of the day, either you make money for yourself or you dont. My livelihood depends solely on a strategy that I have developed which I feel is sound. In the next few months you are going to see a big migration of floor traders who trade plenty of size who are going to be exclusively on the screen. Its not going to be any easier to make money once this happens.
I would be happy to tell who "goldie" is, or that 287 is Man Financial and they probably are the biggest consistent player in the 3rd and 4th option. But to tell you how I make money just wouldnt be worth it.
Again, spend some time, take some risk, and FIGURE IT OUT!!!!!!

 

[suntzu]

Quote from Acidjazz:

Suntzu,

Why do u want to trade outrights, I assume u made money on ur flys, given the risk profile (very little, a significantly reduced margin), surely the returns must have been very decent. Commision intensive ? am I right in thinking that 1 tick covered ur costs, so whats the problem.
Trading outrights while also very profitable if u have a good system, does have a different risk profile. Waiting 2 - 4 wks for a decent profit with a reduced risk profile seems acceptable, but hey what do I know, just my 2 cents worth

Acidjazz,

You're absolutely right about flies being less risky. And commission costs have come down a fair bit.

Problem is that flies take up quite a lot of margin. Sometimes it takes weeks maybe months to see a profit, that is if there's any profit. I'm just trying to figure out a more fluid and less capital intensive way of trading, s'all.

I trade my own capital. I've been in situations where I see potentially better trading opportunities elsewhere, but cos my margin is tied up in a ED butterfly, I've had to forego it.

I'd like to start trading outrights again cos it was great trading 'em when I was in the Simex pit. We had all those little non-verbal cues like order fillers body language and pit sentiment which totally helped us to decide whether it was going to be bullish or bearish for the day. I'm not saying it was always hunky dory but at least there was another potential source of trading profit. Well those physical cues are all gone now in Globex and its really much harder scalping outright EDs in Globex. That's why I'd like to hear from any outright Globex ED traders how they do it.

I'd be grateful for any pointers.

Cheers.

 

[dsguns1]

Quote from suntzu:

Acidjazz,

You're absolutely right about flies being less risky. And commission costs have come down a fair bit.

Problem is that flies take up quite a lot of margin. Sometimes it takes weeks maybe months to see a profit, that is if there's any profit. I'm just trying to figure out a more fluid and less capital intensive way of trading, s'all.

I trade my own capital. I've been in situations where I see potentially better trading opportunities elsewhere, but cos my margin is tied up in a ED butterfly, I've had to forego it.

I'd like to start trading outrights again cos it was great trading 'em when I was in the Simex pit. We had all those little non-verbal cues like order fillers body language and pit sentiment which totally helped us to decide whether it was going to be bullish or bearish for the day. I'm not saying it was always hunky dory but at least there was another potential source of trading profit. Well those physical cues are all gone now in Globex and its really much harder scalping outright EDs in Globex. That's why I'd like to hear from any outright Globex ED traders how they do it.

I'd be grateful for any pointers.

Cheers.

Again, anyone that is willing to give their way of making money is not smart. Remember, its your mney you're giving away.

 

[dsguns1]

Quote from dsguns1:

Again, anyone that is willing to give their way of making money is not smart. Remember, its your mney you're giving away.

Id like to hear others opinions...Honestly, am I wrong about this???????
Suntzu, what do you have to offer me????????
Keep this a great forum, and PROVIDE information, dont leach it out of others who have put in their time.