ES Journal Archive (2006 - 2008)

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Quote from JimmyJam:

Wow, that was one helluva recovery!

I don't think it's going to last. I think the lowest will be revisited, but the market most definitely does look like it's bottoming.

JJ

P.S. It's probably days like this that make Saxon22 believe that he has a viable system, er ... not that he doesn't! :p


Only time will tell what will become of my quest to take money from the ES. All I know is that every day I am learning new stuff and this allows me to improve my system and my chances of becoming a long term participant. Will it happen? I do not know, but so far so good.
My main problem is getting rid of a trade once it is no longer profitable, which has bitten me in the past. However, I ma working on it.

:D :D :D :D
 
Quote from osorico:

Just take em or leave em tidbits. I don't really care. There is no love or hate on my side. Im flat, happy, and disciplined.

BTW: Your mama knows NOTHING about trading.

Osorico

You Know my MAMA????? :confused: :confused:

She is turning 60 soon, do not forget to bring flowers next time you guys meet!
 
It's quite laughable to see some of you lamenting about other's ego, as if the very act of chronically pointing out other's weakness somehow diminishes your own. That's the first impression I got as an outsider looking in. Go figure.

BTW, if you're so much better, post the actual trade log for us to chew on. Who knows, you might be elevated into guruhood.
 
Quote from saliva:

BTW, if you're so much better,

I don't know what is so hard to get it here? :confused:

The reason why we criticize his strategy is not because we hate him, but because we don't want him to blow up. Saxon's strategy is inherently inferior in the long run. Just ask him how he felt after being down -10K and having the nicotine crave, that's why he actually CHANGED his strategy.

Oh yes, today I called the LOD in 5 mins after it happened, can I get the guruhood? :)

P.S.: By the way Saxon is one of my favorite bands, sing Biff, sing! So I couldn't hate anybody called Saxon... :)
 
Quote from Pekelo:

I don't know what is so hard to get it here? :confused:



P.S.: By the way Saxon is one of my favorite bands, sing Biff, sing! So I couldn't hate anybody called Saxon... :)

I remember Saxon. I saw them in the early 80's with Fastway and Iron Maiden. Cool band with a CD named Power and the Glory. Paul Quinn on guitar

Rock On,
Gary
 
Quote from Anekdoten:

Why is it so hard for traders to just add to winning positions and stay put when a position goes against you or take your stop.

It's the greatest mystery to me.

Anek


Quote from volente_00:

EGO

Quote from Anekdoten:
Well, obviously I'm not looking at the superficials of the problem but into much deeper levels.

I understand the reasoning behind it what I don't understand is why it is so hard to overcome this "deficiency".

How many times must you hit your head against a brick wall to understand the real consequences of such actions ?

Naturally, this is different for every trader but for the most part, in my experience, the number is alarmingly high.

My conclusion is that they need to be right when what they need to be doing is making money regardless of how many times they are right or wrong.

Anek

The most direct answer I can give is these traders are not using hard stops in the market. This implies the trader is not expecting or planning for that trade to fail or become a loss. The adding to a loss behavior appears to be reactive and emotional, certainly not part of a coherent trading plan.

So if the trader has a plan to add only to winning positions, and take the full loss quickly when proven wrong, and that trader consistently executes the plan in real-time, then the issue of adding to losers will not arise.

Thus my simple explanation is the trader has formed a bad habit and has no plan to correct the behavior in the future.

A few thoughts as to why this is happening...

One partial explanation which fits in some but certainly not all cases is inexperience. A lack of understanding of the effect a handful of significant account balance drawdowns has on trader performance and confidence. In this vein I will add the tendency to over-estimate of one's actual ability, understanding and skill level.

Wishful thinking is certainly apparent in many cases, the hope factor.

Also, the inability of the trader to admit a mistake quickly and early.

As you point out in your reply, the need to win (which is really a self-esteem issue) runs counter to taking a small loss. Taking a loss is admitting defeat, which is actually a form of giving into a more powerful adversary (crying uncle).... uncle i give, you win...

It occurs to me this also ties back into this debate of trend .vs. counter-trend. It is my observation counter-trend traders (faders) are very susceptible to this behavior. The fader believes so strongly the trend is reversing as to step in front of the established trend with a live trade. The market will almost always give the fader a few ticks of confirmation reinforcing the initial analysis / belief the trend is in fact reversing. Unfortunately ( for the faders ) the retracement is usually short lived and the price trend will then continue on with the next volume driven impulse move forming yet another clear reversal signal (with the fader holding a small loss from the previous signal). It is this rhythm of initial confirmation of the reversal signal, followed by an additional clear reversal signal which tends to draw the fader into this destructive habit of fighting the trend (reactively adding to a loss). Eventually the faders loose confidence in the series of false signals give up and throw in the towel, at which point the trend usually comes to an end...
 
Here is a psychological remedy that works ImE, by setting a hard stop and perhaps deviate only a fraction from it (like 0.5) makes it a sensible risk management, as indeed none of us know WHAT EXACTLY future holds, we expect it to go in our favour based on our experiences. So by honouring a stop we do our bit to preserve capital, which is one of the major issues in investment world. Now if I was to be right, price will no doubt RETURN and continue on its way, so I look at it and assume stops been run and stronger ones accumulated and now my set-up will work in my favour and I RE-ENTER same level or thereabouts. Obviously for this to work consistently we need to estimate correct risk to reward. That is where hard labour comes in, backtest and livetest and actually trade.

When we adjust stops, we are gambling with the unknown factor, as nobody knows what the future holds and of course retail access to information is indeed a limited one, so we can't frontrun anybody above our level.

The lions will always eat first, we can only join in. Retail trader in most cases means 5-6 digit capital and we have to look after it when using high leverage.

Above is ImO strictly, but I hope at least some would see common sense in it.
 
TrendPro, one of the ways to continuously benefit from countertrend trading is to see at what point price has a higher chance of retracing (profit taking/squeezing shorts/shaking out longs/etc.), some times that also happens to be the end of an intraday trend, sometimes it goes so many points in your favour and returns viciously back to your entry so scaling out is THE way to go about it ImO/ImE. The beauty about it is that your stops are very near potential lod/hod, so they are pretty small (not that they can't be when trend following) and the most important part is that you get in before majority does and position yourself for a bounce/reversal with stronger momentum, so you start offloading into late accumulation. ImO.
 
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