ES Journal Archive (2006 - 2008)

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Quote from steve46:


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I know that the original poster believes that swing trading is a better way to go. When it comes to retail trading he is correct.
Properly prepared a retail trader has a better chance of succeeding than an intraday trader. Although the principles he uses do work intraday, the set-ups work better on the longer term because there is less noise.

Good luck

Steve
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On some level I used to believe that longer term trading is "better", whatever "better" means. It is not better. It is just another style/strategy capable of eaning profits, in the right hands.

I disagree however with your statement that a properly prepared retail swing or position trader has a better chance of succeeding than an intraday trader. A properly prepared intraday trader...
  • assumes much less risk due to limited market exposure risk.
  • incurs minimal losses and drawdowns, due to the limited exposure risk. The opposite is also true... Smaller moves and profits.
  • Properly prepared, the intraday trader can accurately participate with multiple smaller opportunities, allowing for multiples of the 100% intraday trading range to be captured. Commission is a cost of doing business. It is not a reason to limit or abandon use of a successful style/strategy.
  • does not incur longer-term hedging costs which facilitates smaller accounts.
  • makes better use of money during non-trending, sideways, or otherwise adverse periods to existing positions held by longer term traders.
  • generally enjoys a smoother equity curve.
At the end of some time interval, the prepared retail swing or position trader will show a few "windfall" profits. A prepared retail intraday trader will show many "non-windfall" profits. Both can produce enormous amounts of profit. Intraday does it with much less exposure risk.

And just a comment regarding your feud with JJ...

JJ's method of learning seems to be shewing the failure rate of a concept, rather than shewing the success rate. In a wierd way it provides an edge. He is his own man, at times zigging when most are zagging. And then defending the zig.


Osorico :)
 
Quote from JimmyJam:

Why thank you Stevie, I'll take your continued studying and commenting on my posts, and the feeble attempts of one-up manship, as the highest compliment. :D


Excellent analogy, I guess it shows my mastery of the concept that I am able to do so across multiple instruments at various frames of reference ... but as such, it only goes so far. Eventually, you're going to need to learn to read price action and anticipate what the market(s) do before they do it, if you keep working at, maybe eventually you will be able to reach this level of trading.


Uh, right :p . The effective use of margin and leverage are the key to maximizing one's trading potential, not to mention that if you're trading multiple markets using different strategies, it's an absolute requirement ... thanks for letting us know how a "professional" puts their assets to the highest and best use when trading leveraged instruments ... :) .


LOL, once again you're putting your limitations and insecurities in the spotlight, not mine. It's apparent that you have trouble dealing with concepts which exist outside of your frame of reference ... more pity you, a square box isn't the solution to everything.



I'm sure you meant position where you typed retail in your hastily construed post, but that is nothing new, we've talked about that point ad nauseum, particularly the "noise factor", which B1S2 has devised a rather excellent work around to I might add, but thanks for trying, I'm sure you really meant to add something new to the thread.

In terms of a position (there's that word again) trader having a better chance to succeed than an intra-day trader, taken out of context the comment doesn't actually mean anything, to succeed at either endeavor a trader is going to have to possess considerable skill ... :) , and a good intra-day trader will take a position player apart due to his use of greater than 100% of an instruments' daily trading range, and skillful use of leverage and margin (oh, I forgot, you wouldn't know anything about that).

Good trading all,

JJ
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Excellent critique , Stevie is going to have to call you Professor from now on. Agree on your assesment that a good daytrader can have more merit than a position trader simply due to the higher pressure to perform.
 
Lance

Your idea is perfect. Let's rename Jimmie. Lets call him

"The Professor"

or we could call him "Marketsurfer Jr" because he is so very good at calling tops and bottoms (like his "daddy" Marketsurf Sr.)

AND as he has just confirmed, he is a "Master" at anticipating market direction. He can do it before the market even opens..:eek:

Except for last thursday, when (temporarily I'm sure) he declared the market was ready to reverse;

------------------------------

"Out at 1504.25

Plus 4pts + on the day, will look to continue to buy drops, this Bull ain't dead yet.

Jimmy Jamster"

------------------------------

Yep, a real "master" at reading price.....:D


Steve
 
Oh so Rico;

Hey, I understand your comment. I think a swing trader who has good entry skills is going to weather the storm easier than an intraday trader. Most intraday traders can't keep a realistic stop. They get anxious and get washed out early. Swing trading you have to give your trade some room to wiggle. How much depends on the market, but if you look at how B1S2 does it, I think you will see that he gives his trade a wider stop than you might as an intraday trader.

I think you are correct as regards use of money during what I call a "bracketed market" (chop)..I think however that it depends on the individuals skills. For instance. I have some skills and if I am able to identify a specific kind of bracket market, I am not adverse to trading around a longer term position. I lot of guys do this profitably.

As regards commissions, well professionals generally have setups that you can't beat. So no matter what kind of commish you have, if you aren't pro you're paying significantly more than those guys. If you are trading more frequently, you have to overcome that added expense. Again it is (in my opinion) a matter of how good you are. If you have real talent and know how to restrict your activity to high % trades, then it isn't as big a factor.

On the subject of equity curve, I think it depends more on the details of your system (your style). When I was active, our office analyzed individual performance using a "Z" calc. This recorded the number of winning and losing streaks and our risk manager tried to advise us on how we might improve by diversifying our approaches (time frame mostly). What I learned from my own performance record was that it was better for me to combine longer and shorter term trades. To do this, I used to trade indexes short term (intraday), bonds and currencies longer term.

Just from my own experience, it seemed that new traders coming into my office did better when they incorporated a longer term trade into their books.

Good luck to you sir
Steve
 
With his stated lurking, trollish behavior and rude, insulting comments Steve46 does far more to discredit himself than anyone's intelligent response to his diatribe ever could, and that's saying a lot, seeing as how the so-called professional (hehe :D ) has been thoroughly schooled by the posters on this thread as to what real retail trading is all about (performance bonds don't matter, give me a break ...)

While he may be too stupid to realize it. :eek:, I'm sure that fact is not loss on the readers of the thread.
***
Your analysis of all of the strengths intra-day scalping is right on target Osorico, and you actually laid out the blueprint for how and why to do it successfully, that's very generous of you, and it's definitely more information than I'm willing to give out ... your comment showing how my process works for me shows that you also have more than a little insight into human psychology as well, hmm, wouldn't want to play you in a game of poker.
***
The only perceived weakness of the intra-day scalper is the inability to scale-up to decent size, when trading using this method, I find that limitation can be overcome by using a consistent approach and trading it like clockwork, very much like that which Lance Carson has demonstrated with his calls. Then, using a set theory model instead of an arithmetical or geometrical one to increase position size, you will be able to scale-up relatively quickly, while consistently taking the exact same setups.

Good trading (to those who know how), :cool:

Jimmy Jam

P.S. Nice re-write SteveO, I'm sure you don't want Osorico showing you up as well ...
 
Don't get your panties in a bunch "Jimmie". When you are wrong, you are going to get a little bit of a verbal whipping. I will try not to make you cry in public..

If you want to avoid this, get yourself an education.

and

Stop commenting about stuff you know nothing about.

:)
 
Quote from steve46:

Don't get your panties in a bunch "Jimmie". When you are wrong, you are going to get a little bit of a verbal whipping. I will try not to make you cry in public..

If you want to avoid this, get yourself an education.

and

Stop commenting about stuff you know nothing about.

:)
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Nope, I'm commenting about things which you know nothing about. :)

JJ
 
Since Jimmie is having a break down. I do want to comment on the "performance bond" issue.

Ironically Jimmie is correct in this way. Because he probably has little or no money left in his account, he has to know in great detail just how much money he needs to keep on trading. Otherwise his broker will pull the plug and he is done.....

I will guess that out of necessity, little Jimmie knows just what his margin requirements are for ONE contract..

Think about it. In a professional office, none of the traders worry about margin. We had a person to do that for us. If you were unprofitable, you would be gone, and THEN you would have to concern yourself with margin.

Worrying about margin is a sure sign of an unprofitable trader.

What a surprise that little Jimmie is so concerned with the subject.

I am done with you for tonight "Jimmie".



:)
 
Quote from steve46:

Since Jimmie is having a break down. I do want to comment on the "performance bond" issue.

Ironically Jimmie is correct in this way.

...
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How sad, it's posters like this that keep anyone from sharing any real information on these threads.

JJ
 
Jimmie

Here is your chance to show us what you mean by "real information".

Here is YOUR comment.

-----------------------------------------

"The only perceived weakness of the intra-day scalper is the inability to scale-up to decent size, when trading using this method, I find that limitation can be overcome by using a consistent approach and trading it like clockwork, very much like that which Lance Carson has demonstrated with his calls. Then, using a set theory model instead of an arithmetical or geometrical one to increase position size, you will be able to scale-up relatively quickly, while consistently taking the exact same setups."

-------------------------------------------------

Pretty powerful statement..."The ONLY perceived weakness...
is the inability to scale up.....Wow!

So, go ahead....show us how "Set Theory" will set us free....

"you will be able to scale up relatively quickly, while consistently taking the EXACT same setups".

I am sure we are all interested in how this works and YOU are the self-proclaimed expert..."I find this limitation can be overcome...."

Nobody can stop you from sharing real information Jimmie. The problem is you have NO...REAL.....INFORMATION to share....:D

Steve
 
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