Duref Mudgins Invites Jack Hershey to Reminisce

[jack hershey]

Quote from Long&Strong:

Jack's total track record consists of a 24% loss in a trading contest and a $24,000 loss in stocks, for someone that boasts 50 years of trading success he doesn't even own his own house.. he is a ridiculously insecure old man that sports a ponytail and lives off his partner and out of her house.. he claims to have written books and been published but upon investigation they turn out to be e-pamphlets.. a lifetime of failure has produced a very fragile ego and his main protege had to be taken to a cloakroom and given decent shoes to attend a function with other traders.. you do the math

Chiefraven,

Read the above. It will give you the most delightful picture of my total everything. Fortunately the management of ET makes it available every day as a statement of their regard for me.

Regards,

Jack

Oh. I also spent many years in the territories before they were re-established. One of my best friends was the head gov't negotiator with the First Nations people.

 

[chiefraven]

there's no need to talk about a certain individual..... track records speak louder than words.... how one person depict another means nothing to any of us... but our egos.

we are talking about trading here... and i dont care how good a trading system may look like, if there's no track record to back it up.... it means nothing.


and again, i have already seen posts after posts about these things being in existence... yet nobody is willing to show a simple link of such record or video.

and i am well familiar with your old system... the equities method... i didn't bother to dive too deep into the future method, simply because.....it just doesn't seem believable... especially when the equities version are not even profitable... but i will not explain the reason why here.

perhaps if you use the dryup volume and peak volume and first rising volume and all that as a way of finding stocks that move.... however, with the stoch and buy as soon as volume is reached is not a viable strategy. in other words, the idea is good and simple.... but like anything.... without the right and proper tweaking, money mangement, it's just another failing method.

the futures method, i wont even get into it.... haha

 

[lilduckling]

Quote from lilduckling:

Oh come on, Jack, ….. come on……setting aside the trading aspect altogether, how can you say that?

Are you denying, here and now, that your conveyance of information is isn't as palatable as Steven Hawkins explaining quantum physics to a group of 1st graders?? If you can not or refuse to speak in understandable terms, then what’s the point? Is it so you will be revered as a great mind? Well in trading it doesn’t work quite that way. Now im not here to shoot down your trading ability or your methods, my hat’s off to any trader that’s been around the same time Jesse Livermore was alive. Or the fact that you are a herald for IBD.
( I won’t go into here how dangerous it is to buy their top RS stocks) No, my beef is how you present your ideas.
I have visited several other trading communities outside of ET, and almost everyone that mentions your name state the same as what I have.

It is tough to be in your shoes. No one here understands that, no one. But I do. I know that you are in a room with two doors … one opens out, the other opens in. The one that opens out has the 15 minutes behind it. The other one that opens in has the reaper behind it.. and you’re fumbling with the keys to open the door out, before the other opens in.

Best to you sir.

PS a shame I was not worthy of your attention

had to edit the word IS to ISN'T (time limit ran out)

 

[Vienna]

Quote from chiefraven:

how would trade records and full day's video recording not work??

we are after results aren't we?

now, spyder and hershey both said that this video exists.... may you perhaps lend your assitance? =D

so how come it wont help? because you dont believe in the records from your own trades ?

Now why would you possibly assume that anybody demonstrating a method FOR FREE on an internet forum somehow OWES you track records? Jack or Spyder are not your hedge fund managers. You are not paying them a commission or giving them your funds to manage. They offer you a method for free.

Having said that, if I felt altruistic enough to show my way of trading on an internet forum, and anybody would ask me in anything less than a very respectful attitude for proof, I would probably tell him to go jump in a lake. There is something impatient and lazy in such requests, and the demanding tone would be more than I would put up with. The combination of being lazy and unable to show respect are qualities of people that I would not consider worth teaching. (And I am not even talking about the basket cases, such as enraged wackos that are so frustrated with their trading that they post 30 times per day, without even one post being worth reading).

Actually, to NOT offer any spoon-fed proof would seem like a pretty good way to separate serious people that were worth my time from people that were not. The ones that would be worth my time would be the ones that do the research and find out for themselves. The other ones- why bother with them? This would be a good filter... which I suspect is exactly what Jack is doing....

BTW, I don't trade the method... looked into to the PV method, but am working on improving and refining what I am doing and lack sufficient time to explore either PVT or SCT, but I might one day. You can always learn more, right?

 

[chiefraven]

he certainly doesn't have to... and i'm not putting a knife on his neck and making him do just that....

however, aren't you curious? i mean, especially if he says it's already there... then, the most he has to do is post a link right?

also, i'm doing this to save everyone the trouble.... nobody needs to show any records, but as tenacious as these defenders seem, i would expect them to at least show people a record of some sort just to shut somebody up right?

speaking from a logical point of view.

it just puzzles me...that's why.... and i'm nto asking HIM to give us a record... notice i wasn't trying to attack him in any shape or form... but if any of the spyder/hershey trader wants to show us what they have been defending for so long... it would certainly clear the air a bit...... seeing that such prove does exist already... perhaps someone would just show us a link.

and i'm also not trading his method.... however, like many, i am curious, nonetheless.

 

[Vienna]

Quote from chiefraven:


however, aren't you curious? i mean, especially if he says it's already there... then, the most he has to do is post a link right?

Regarding the PVT, there was a summary of all the trades called and the result in the Spyder Equities Thread somewhere, i think at the end- go look for it. Also, somebody backtested it partially in the PVT Test thread, before the thread got out of control due to lack of/ incompetent moderating and the crazies coming in.

Re SCT- there are some videos around somewhere on the net I think, but am not sure where. I am satisfied with the behavior I see of price around channels to give it the benefit, but that's me.

 

[lilduckling]

Quote from chiefraven:

he certainly doesn't have to... and i'm not putting a knife on his neck and making him do just that....

however, aren't you curious? i mean, especially if he says it's already there... then, the most he has to do is post a link right?

also, i'm doing this to save everyone the trouble.... nobody needs to show any records, but as tenacious as these defenders seem, i would expect them to at least show people a record of some sort just to shut somebody up right?

speaking from a logical point of view.

it just puzzles me...that's why.... and i'm nto asking HIM to give us a record... notice i wasn't trying to attack him in any shape or form... but if any of the spyder/hershey trader wants to show us what they have been defending for so long... it would certainly clear the air a bit...... seeing that such prove does exist already... perhaps someone would just show us a link.

and i'm also not trading his method.... however, like many, i am curious, nonetheless.

the information is out there as stated in prior posts by Jack. You just have to go and look for it. It wont be easy however... in fact, did you ever see the movie "National Treasure"..... yeah, kind of like that. But you have to prove you are worth it. The scattered posts and foggy, puzzling speech is just there to seperate the traders that dont really want to find success and the ones that do.

As far as the defensive posts about the system that have been posted repeatedly ... that there should be enought for you to recognize that it is legit. The fact that u question it only means you are a pretender, and will never be a successful trader.
I mean look at it this way, if you invented a machine that turns lead into gold, would you not go and tell everone that your machine really works?? Would you not pound on every door or try to get on TV and convince everone your machine works?? OFCOURSE YOU WOULD!! only a dummy would stay in their basement quitely turning lead into gold without telling anyone else.

you are not ready my friend.

 

[jack hershey]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from jack hershey:



Everything we have been doing is designed to help people learn effectively and efficiently.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Oh come on, Jack, ….. come on……setting aside the trading aspect altogether, how can you say that?

Purposeful learning is a process. Knowledge deals with facts primarily. Skills deal with the operating of the mind. Experience is the manner of the process of learning.

As you see and you comment, your mind is not going through experiences that are helpful to you for learning purposefully.

Many people look at PVT and SCT and just walk away. Sometimes, I suggest to people to take a walk as a time saver for them.

Other times I see people who are really ready to groove on PVT and SCT.

I also see and hear a lot about persons who have really made their mark by purposeful learning and have succeeded in really great ways.

In trading, a person builds his mind to be able to team up with the market and as a consequence make high velocity money. When such a person comes along, he is oriented to spending time in ways that allow for growth of knowledge and the acquisition of skills.

Take a look at the few hundred posts of charts and tables of the learning process that I have created by drawing and tabulating. Maybe I should post 150 of these illustrations here in this thread to establish what is going on in the purposeful process of learning how to learn by thinking which successfully builds the mind.

Once I was in chilly Chicago at the headquarters of the American Hospital Association. Among other things, that week I was in two rooms: one was the place where people worked with autisitc young children. In contrast, the other room , a conference room, was filled with Kellogg Corp's advertising executives.

I did basically the same thing in both rooms. In one room the children set a record that was 300% greater than a prior testing record. In the other room an October deadline was lifted in January so I could bid on stuffers fro the cereals that Kellogg needed. They let me ask two questions: What will you pay per unit? and How many do you want for the year? They asked me how long I would need to respond.*

Lets look at the opportunities I was facing and look at the device that provided the acceptable solution. See if you can understand me typing to you as the children did and the advertising execs most certainly did.

I handed out the same thing to each group. Got that? I did not tell them what it was in either case. Both groups started to play.

Four colors of wax soaked yarns (about 10 or 12 pieces) were attached to a 1" by 6" strip of clear plastic.

This row of wax soaked yarn pieces attached by pressure to a strip of plastic was called a Wikki Stick. Wikki Stick. Do you see the wheels spinning in ET?

Both groups did one thing and it was the same thing.

What did I do? I made it possible for doors in the mind to open.

Autistic children kept going and going and going and making little SYMBOLS that they could not otherwise communicate up TO THAT POINT IN THEIR LITTLE LIVES.

I bought a waste product from refineries by the tractor trailor load (they threw in an extra load for every load purchased.)

The advertising execs saw a stuffer that was thin, could be used in any size box and this Wikki Stick was irriesistable to EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE ROOM WITHOUT BEING TOLD ANYTHING ABOUT WHAT TO DO WITH IT.

Why did the children play with Wikki Sticks and hold them up to those who were helping them to learn to communicate? Why did the Wikki Sticks get brought to AHS and get into that room?

You, as we see cannot pick up an idea; neither can 80% of the people who answer polls in ET. You, as we see cannot read or think critically. Two pieces of yarn of uneven length is where the pool extraction algorithm begins. We vary the uneveness and we make all the combinations and add the volume of the P, V realtion. Three pieces of yarn max for all possible cases.

Read this: Put some white space at the right of your chart so you can see the future and see it comeinto the present. Make your scales on your chart always have the same spacing...

How can an autistic child pick up a Wikki Stik and communicate with it? how can an advertising exec give me two anwsers and a submission preparation time that is sufficient for me to fill all of his Kellogg boxes for a year after he suspended a past competitive deadline?

You make some bullsh*t post about your reading problems when you can SEE the bars on any chart you have ever seen is offering much more that 3X the daily range every day and you don't think I can support the learning process of ANYONE in the world who wants to be rich and has a mind that stills works.

I am beginning to think that there are a lot of dumb people in ET.

Breaking a record by 300% the first day out with autistic kids and then just multiplying two numbers together for a profitable bid (and setting up a new ten stream production line) is my normal style. The CEO of the new Wikki Stik provider was awarded a Business Woman of the Year Award in Phoenix for that corp within a year (Front page news on the business section, go scramble guys).

*The CEO asked me as we were getting in a cab, how I had the balls to ask the two questions. I told her that it was logical since they all had yellow pads with their creations on them that they were going to take back to their desks. I felt I could use their price, adjust how much wax and yarn and have production lines adjusted to a 20% profit. I had done the bid on my stenno pad already and covered it up with yarn pieces and closed the pad.

 

[lilduckling]

Quote from 2seconds:

[/B]

You are obviously a fool that does not recognize talent when you see it. Otherwise you would immediately fall to your knees and beg Mr. Grob for forgiveness for your insolence. Anyone in this board, ANYONE, will readily tell you that the more complicated your explanation of an idea or system is, the more valid it is.
A true scholar of the market, when conveying an idea, desires a wry easiness of understanding of his/ her message. It should flow freely, like molasses in a cold winter night. The text should light up clearly, like a wooden light bulb.

It takes talent to communicate in that manner. Reserved only to those who have done their time in Harvard or Yale. You, on the other hand, are just a little man, whose small under developed mind is a few notches short in the evolutionary scale to grasp at such ideas. A pity. A pity that great scholars like Mr. Grob, have to endure the company of linguistic peasants polluting these boards.

It is hard to soar like an eagle, when one is surrounded by turkeys, such as in Mr. Grobs situation.

So take these words in heed, and hopefully after long contemplation in your part, you will come to realize that Mr. Grob is just a vehicle that transports you to market success. A vehicle that requires a certain amount of mental horse power move it.

Anyone that does not agree with this assessment is a lost fool indeed.

 

[I am...]

Quote from jack hershey:

Purposeful learning is a process. Knowledge deals with facts primarily. Skills deal with the operating of the mind. Experience is the manner of the process of learning.

I also see and hear a lot about persons who have really made their mark by purposeful learning and have succeeded in really great ways.

Knowledge is total. It is not learned. It is *given*. It does not change. This is Mind's natural state. With knowledge it is able to create. Without knowledge it *makes*. Judgement presumes to alter the natural state by introducing change to a changeless mind. Learning is change of mind. The world begins with a change of mind about a changless mind. This is not really possible. Learning, then, endeavors to make the impossible possible, and the possible into "facts". As learning steps into the unknown it leads further away from knowledge. As the learner changes his mind about how the mind operates, he may then learn his way back to knowledge, or seek to gain the whole world through iterative refinement. It is only the denial of knowledge that makes learning necessary. The further away from knowledge learning leads, the more there is to learn to unlearn in order to return.

Knowledge is total or not at all. The alternative to total knowledge is perception, a kind of ignorance, which introduces an element of uncertainty into every "fact". Perception is not for discovering truth. Perception is for seeing what you want to see, regardless of truth. The only "fact" in perception is that you see what you believe, and you believe what you wish. Wherever there is a wish, there has been a judgement about what is a fact. Therefore, you see what you want. You want what you determine to be true, regardless of total knowledge. As you experience what perceptual judgement produces, you make adjustments to what you think, changing your mind as you go. In this way, this world is learned, that is, you make it up as you go along. Kind of like iterative refinement.

Each decision/judgement within perception presumes that it is possible to "lose" if the choice is *incorrect*. The prospect of possible loss reinforces the belief that by changing one's mind, iteratively, the learner can "succeed", or *win*. This is meaningless unless the learning leads back to knowledge. Knowledge is an attribute of "soul". A good learner could presumably *gain* the whole world by outwitting other learners regarding established "facts" set up by the mind that makes this world through is judgements. Yet this will come at the expense of *soul* if it reinforces win-loss scenarios as "facts". Knowledge deals only with win-win scenarios, restoring total abundance to all who *know*. Life cannot be *won*. It is known. Neither can it be *lost*. It is blown on win-loss scenarios, made "fact" by learning that a changeless Mind can be changed.

Knowledge cannot be learned. Knowledge can only be restored as learning is unlearned, and perception is *righted* so that it reflects knowledge. As it is righted, experience will justify the unlearning process.

Jesus