Wife called just moments ago from Jerusalem. I asked her if she was aware of the letter sent to the Times by Einstein and the other prominent Jews in 1948 condemning Begin and his tactics. She really had no very informed rebuttal. She said she knew little about it...(it was quite a few years before she was born).
But what she did say was that from what she remembers hearing about it, what happened was that the Israeli "terrorists" bombed the King David Hotel in retaliation for the public hanging of Israeli "freedom fighters" by the British.
She was really pretty unclear about the exact circumstances, and like VVV said, she believes that there were shameful acts on both sides but it is time to go forward and let the dead rest. The world is a lot different now than 55 years ago. Also, she mentioned, that the palestinians were not the victims of the Begin gang, and therefore there is really no justification to be taken by the palestinians in this regard (vengeance for prior attacks 55 years ago). And the British, who were targeted by the Israelis have long since come to terms with the Israeli gov't.
Further, she said that Einstein and the rest that signed that letter were far left wing spokespeople on the subject and not truly representative of the feelings of the majority of the jews in the US at the time (who obviously supported the fight for Israeli independence).
Now, I know this sounds muddled. It sounded muddled to me tonight when she said her piece on the phone. But again, she did not deny the circumstances or the events referred to, nor did she blindly accept whatever was done on behalf of the Israeli cause. So essentially she said (without saying the words) that you can and sometimes must fight for what you believe is a just cause. Apparently there are major differences of opinion about what the definition of a "just cause" is. So if Traderfut believes the palestinians are fighting for a "just cause" then they are fighting a worthy fight. But the tactics of suicide bombers.....how can that ever be justified? The intentional murder of children and non-combatants. Women and babies. These tactics are NOT what were employed by the "terrorists" of the Begin "Freedom Party". So there are differences. Does this justify the acts of terror? In my opinion no. But for many, the ends will justify the means. And for them, the answer may well be "yes".
One thing maybe worth considering. This is just a thought of my own. This is not from my more "informed" wife. Nor is it necessarily valid. Just something that sort of popped into my head just now:
The "Freedom Party" achieved their goals. The palestinians have not. The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki achieved their goals as well, which was to stop the prolonging of war and death. So in that line of thought, Begin and his gang did what worked. Arafat has been doing what hasn't worked for what? 40 years or so? So maybe evil leaders can be ranked according to effectiveness too. Let's say that Begin was the devil himself. At least he achieved his goals. Arafat hasn't achieved a single thing. So if you are looking to claim a "homeland", then maybe finding an evil but effective leader would make sense. Arafat is certainly "evil" but just as certainly ineffective. Get a thug to run the Palestinian Authority. But at least an effective thug. Then, hopefully peace can be realized and all the terror and bloodshed will have at least not been in total vain. As is the case now.
Shalom,
rs7
But what she did say was that from what she remembers hearing about it, what happened was that the Israeli "terrorists" bombed the King David Hotel in retaliation for the public hanging of Israeli "freedom fighters" by the British.
She was really pretty unclear about the exact circumstances, and like VVV said, she believes that there were shameful acts on both sides but it is time to go forward and let the dead rest. The world is a lot different now than 55 years ago. Also, she mentioned, that the palestinians were not the victims of the Begin gang, and therefore there is really no justification to be taken by the palestinians in this regard (vengeance for prior attacks 55 years ago). And the British, who were targeted by the Israelis have long since come to terms with the Israeli gov't.
Further, she said that Einstein and the rest that signed that letter were far left wing spokespeople on the subject and not truly representative of the feelings of the majority of the jews in the US at the time (who obviously supported the fight for Israeli independence).
Now, I know this sounds muddled. It sounded muddled to me tonight when she said her piece on the phone. But again, she did not deny the circumstances or the events referred to, nor did she blindly accept whatever was done on behalf of the Israeli cause. So essentially she said (without saying the words) that you can and sometimes must fight for what you believe is a just cause. Apparently there are major differences of opinion about what the definition of a "just cause" is. So if Traderfut believes the palestinians are fighting for a "just cause" then they are fighting a worthy fight. But the tactics of suicide bombers.....how can that ever be justified? The intentional murder of children and non-combatants. Women and babies. These tactics are NOT what were employed by the "terrorists" of the Begin "Freedom Party". So there are differences. Does this justify the acts of terror? In my opinion no. But for many, the ends will justify the means. And for them, the answer may well be "yes".
One thing maybe worth considering. This is just a thought of my own. This is not from my more "informed" wife. Nor is it necessarily valid. Just something that sort of popped into my head just now:
The "Freedom Party" achieved their goals. The palestinians have not. The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki achieved their goals as well, which was to stop the prolonging of war and death. So in that line of thought, Begin and his gang did what worked. Arafat has been doing what hasn't worked for what? 40 years or so? So maybe evil leaders can be ranked according to effectiveness too. Let's say that Begin was the devil himself. At least he achieved his goals. Arafat hasn't achieved a single thing. So if you are looking to claim a "homeland", then maybe finding an evil but effective leader would make sense. Arafat is certainly "evil" but just as certainly ineffective. Get a thug to run the Palestinian Authority. But at least an effective thug. Then, hopefully peace can be realized and all the terror and bloodshed will have at least not been in total vain. As is the case now.
Shalom,
rs7