Don't attempt to build positions intraday at Tradestation

[wjk]

Quote from jprad:

Sorry, but TradeStation's right, it's you who's completely confused.

If you make three separate buys and sell them all at once then you've executed three trades because each purchase is recorded as a separate lot.

from IB:
http://individuals.interactivebrokers.com/en/accounts/margin.php?p=d&ib_entity=llc

from examples at this page.

"On Monday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. Later on that same day, another 500 shares of XYZ are purchased. In after hours trading on Monday, 1000 shares of XYZ are sold. This is considered to be 1-day trade."

2 entries same day, 1 exit, 1 day trade.

 

[wjk]

Quote from jprad:

The key word is "position," all lots of the same security.

In other words, you have to go completely flat in a given stock before making another purchase in order to make the previous day's buys not count against the PDT count.

From IB


"-On Monday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. On Tuesday, another 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. On Wednesday, 1000 shares of XYZ stock are sold. None of these are considered to be day trades."

 

[wjk]

Let's just simplify it. Here they all are. I trust IB's interpretation over all other brokers. My argurment is supported within these examples. As I indicated, brokers have their own rules and can do whatever they want. I don't believe I am "confused" as you indicated. If I am, then so is IB.

Examples of Day Trades
-On Monday, 1000 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. Later on that same day, 1000 shares of XYZ stock are sold. This is considered to be a day trade.

-On Wednesday, 1000 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. Later on that same day, 500 shares of XYZ stock are sold. This is considered to be a day trade.

-On Monday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. Later on that same day, another 500 shares of XYZ are purchased. In after hours trading on Monday, 1000 shares of XYZ are sold. This is considered to be 1-day trade.

-On Monday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. On Tuesday, another 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. Later on Tuesday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are sold. This is considered to be 1-day trade.

-On Thursday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased in pre-market. In after hours trading on Thursday, 200 shares of XYZ stock are sold. This is considered to be a day trade.

-On Monday, customer sells short 10 YXX September 2005 90 calls and simultaneously buys 10 YXX December 2005 95 calls (combination order type). Later on Monday, customer buys back 5 YXX September 2005 90 calls and sells 5 YXX December 2005 95 calls for a profit. This is considered to be 2 day trades (one day trade for each leg of the spread).

-On Thursday, customer buys 500 shares of YXZ stock. Later on Thursday, customer sells 1500 shares of YXZ stock (reversal creates new short position). On Friday, customer purchases 1000 shares of YXZ stock. This would be considered to be 1-day trade.

Non-Day Trade Examples:
-On Monday, 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. On Tuesday, another 500 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. On Wednesday, 1000 shares of XYZ stock are sold. None of these are considered to be day trades.

-On Thursday, customer buys 500 shares of YZZ stock. On Friday, customer sells 500 shares of YZZ stock. Later on Friday, customer buys 500 shares of YZZ stock. This is not considered to be a day trade.

-On Friday, 1000 shares of XYZ stock are purchased. On the following Monday, 1000 shares of XYZ stock is sold. This is not considered to be a day trade.

 

[flyingdutchmen]

what about TradeSignal5 http://www.tradesignal.com/Default.aspx
i am a user of this software, it is very populair in germany
this way you still could use easy language skripting
but would be limited to IB as your broker

 

[jprad]

Quote from wjk:

I trust IB's interpretation over all other brokers.

And, apparently, over FINRA's as well.

That said, there's really nothing left to discuss here.

 

[wjk]

Quote from jprad:


That said, there's really nothing left to discuss here.

Agreed

 

[Mario66]

Quote from cubsguy81:

Use lightspeed with a charting provider of your choice....

yea thats the way to go. lightspeed will give you esignal charts for free if you do 250k shares a month.

 

[stock777]

You ever notice all the noobs always 'miss great entries'.

There hasn't been a Great Entry since Kennedy slept with Monroe.

 

[LongArm]

Second, it's not the number of trades in a single day that matters. The rule comes into effect when you do 4 or more round-trips over a 5 day period.

The four or more round-trips in 5 days must be DAYTRADES (the opening and closing of a position on the SAME DAY). If you're suggesting overnight trades matter as far as the PDT rules, you're wrong.

In other words, you have to go completely flat in a given stock before making another purchase in order to make the previous day's buys not count against the PDT count.

A previous day's buys never count against the PDT count.

You seem to be misinterpreting the FINRA rule, particularly the exception (a.), but it's actually pretty simple:

(i) The term “day trading” means the purchasing and selling or the selling and purchasing of the same security on the same day in a margin account except for:

a. a long security position held overnight and sold the next day prior to any new purchase of the same security, or...

All this means is that (i) opening and closing a position on the same day is a daytrade, whereas (a.) closing an overnight position and then opening a new position in the same stock on the same day is NOT. Open-close, yes. Close-open, no.

I trust IB's interpretation over all other brokers.

And, apparently, over FINRA's as well.

There's nothing in IB's interpretation of the rules that's in conflict with FINRA's.

 

[wjk]

Quote from stock777:

You ever notice all the noobs always 'miss great entries'.

There is a difference between a missed entry and a denied entry. Define it as you wish, but in my book their are two types of entries. There are great entries (meet all my criteria, and the only acceptable entry), and shitty entries (don't meet all my criteria, never considered, chased, etc.) Hardly the actions of a noob, but no matter. It is a relative term.

I was denied my entry in my <25k account on a play that met all my criteria because of a daytrading rule that is not really a daytrading rule, but a brokerage rule.