Do I have Illusions of Grandeur ?

Quote from venturerider2:

Slyfoxed,
The future big swinging dicks will come from the major firms (investment banks or established hedge funds) which provide a "sophisticated environment" with sophisticated resources and tools that most prop traders can't touch, never mind understand. Keep in mind when I use the term "prop traders" I am referring to the firms that you read about in this forum. But let's not forget that Lehman, Morgan Stanley, GS, UBS, etc, all have proprietary trading areas and the backbone of those areas are the quants/scientists - and that will only continue.
Venturerider2
More...

Slyfxed

The 2 most important qualifications for a trader:
1) Independent thinker.
2) Psychologically tough.

Things that help to raise money if you want to be HF manager
1) Pedigree education (Ivy league), job (Goldman, hot shot professor)
2) Being pretty, charismatic
3) Last name like Rothschild, Mountbatten, you get the idea. Something ended in -berg or -stein will definitely help in NYC.

See the difference?

IB trading strategies are overrated. Prop shops and IBs use similar things, the difference is that IBanks hype themselves to death, to attract clients and naive graduates to work for them.
IBs have the advantage pump and dump is legal for them. Try doing that if you are a NJ kid. Inside information is not illegal in many countries, that's why I-banks have fat global market depts.

trading models any joe-sixpac can't understand my ass. there are models like that but I-banks don't have it, you would have to be an idiot to give away those things for 200K a year. trade it yourself or get a partner to split profits 50/50.

In conclusion, you have to learn to think on your own before even thinking going into trading.

Wanting to go to work for Goldman or Morgan Stanley is like wanting to change masters, maybe better pay, more prestige but you will still be a slave.

By the way, congratulations for figuring out corporate America is a loser's game for 99.9% of people, but trading is not the only way out, I suggest Kiyosaki's Rich Dad Poor Dad, with your background I would also think about a web-based business.
 
Quote from Steve Tvardek:

Not all prop firms are the same. In my 2+ years at my firm, not once has anyone told me to trade more and churn more commissions. As a matter of fact, we were told to trade LESS when times were slow. They are more interested in developing successful traders for the long term rather than churn a guys 5k stake and then let him go and repeat the cycle.

I am starting to sense that those who hate prop firms so much either went prop and failed there (blew out their cap), or sat there for months and months making nothing and felt betrayed.
Otherwise it would make no sense for these people to have such strong feelings.
More...



I worked at large equity prop firm for 7 yrs. They were very very successful because they let guys trade and weren't all over them. Unfortuneatly equity trading went to cr#p when decimals/trading in pennies came in and killed the game. I then traded at 2 different prop firms (futures). One where they let you trade your style, but gave you no downsde risk (trade 100 lots of minis with a 5000 dollar downside...good luck). Then a big prop firm where they tried to brainwash you into trading their style (do a ton of trades getting in and out all day for tiny wins/losses). Is an assinine way to trade.

The firm where you work sounds great and I congratulate you for landing there. If more prop shops were doing what your guys do, there woeld be a ton of better traders out there. I am not bitter vs all prop groups, I just think some of the ones who I traded for have insane thinking and their ways will lead you right to the poor house.
 
Quote from Slyfoxed:

Hello All,

I need some advice from the forum and the seasoned professionals.

I would basically have to give up a stable income, with a great company, but with a limited future,

for a unstable income, but with a potentially unlimited future.

Any advice, thoughts comments or concerns would be greatly appreciated.
More...

I shortened your question simply to offer a comment, and a comment to many on the board. First off, there are very (very) few "jobs" in the trading arena any longer, no real need to "pay" someone to risk your money.

The advice about saving $$ is a good one.

But the irony of this board is that when I put up a note about one of my traders, Darren Clifford, making about $350K at age 25, and having 30 people trade under him, many said "oh, that's nothing...I know this guy and that guy who makes a zillion times more, etc." - well, I think Darren and his team do extremely well.

He is the exception, but he shows the reality that it can happen with the proper amount of training, drive, and capital usage.

All that being said, get a couple of years under your belt, save $100K or so, and then explore your options.

Good Luck!!

Don
 
Thanks all for your advice.

It has been very insightful and helpful.


I have put quitting my day job on hold for now, and am re-evaluating my current position, and career path.
 
Quote from Don Bright:

I shortened your question simply to offer a comment, and a comment to many on the board. First off, there are very (very) few "jobs" in the trading arena any longer, no real need to "pay" someone to risk your money.

The advice about saving $$ is a good one.

But the irony of this board is that when I put up a note about one of my traders, Darren Clifford, making about $350K at age 25, and having 30 people trade under him, many said "oh, that's nothing...I know this guy and that guy who makes a zillion times more, etc." - well, I think Darren and his team do extremely well.

He is the exception, but he shows the reality that it can happen with the proper amount of training, drive, and capital usage.

All that being said, get a couple of years under your belt, save $100K or so, and then explore your options.

Good Luck!!

Don
More...


Anyone making 350k in this environment is doing great. If they are doing it trading equities they are a hero.
 
Quote from EPrado:

Anyone making 350k in this environment is doing great. If they are doing it trading equities they are a hero.
More...

I agree, and even more so for the newer, younger set. We, of course, have our seasoned traders who have been doing this well or better for years...but I like to see the younger group learn and perform so well.

(and isn't the phrase "Delusions of Grandeur"?)



Don:)
 
Quote from Don Bright:

I agree, and even more so for the newer, younger set. We, of course, have our seasoned traders who have been doing this well or better for years...but I like to see the younger group learn and perform so well.

(and isn't the phrase "Delusions of Grandeur"?)



Don:)
More...


Problem is some of these younger people hear about the days of making 100 points in qcom on a daytrade and they get all excited. Will never see those days again. When training a new guy, the best thing is to make sure their charts only go back to 2002. I traded equities from 1992 til 2002. Luckily I learned how to "really" trade when things were normal. Unlike many of the young dudes i saw start in 1999, make a ton of money, then blow it all during a 6 month span in 2002.

I got out of equities when The SEC/NYSE decided to screw every equity trader and go into penny increments. Bastards.....
 
Quote from Slyfoxed:

Hello All,


- my current manager is questionable
- the current work I do gets very little respect within the company, (other then from our team) b/c its pretty much grunt work
- 25-30 years later I would only probably be middle mangement with an avg 120K-150K salary (If i stayed that long)

I feel that this is may not be the place for me.
More...

sounds like most prop firms :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top