Disillusioned

Quote from Dustin:

This isn't relevent. Everyone here that actually trades for a living is trading with margin anywhere from 4:1 at a minimum up to 2000:1 (not a typo) or more. If you have a $20k account and have $2m to trade with could you live off 10%? Hell yes!


I dont know about everyone else here but I never use more then 2:1 margin. I do hold overnight positions though. I doubt anyone can trade over 4:1 margin and stomach the drawdowns. If someone can achieve less then a 5% drawdown in equity with over 4:1 margin then I have alot to learn still. But honestly I dont think this is achievable by too many :)
 
Quote from mokwit:
Daytrading is one of those things where by the time you can do it you no longer want to do it.
Amusing.

However 'day trading for a living' is a self defeating prescription. Instead trade only to make your pile. The difference is not understood at ET. Or in fact it is a difference that ETers do not want to understand.
:)
 
CANSLIM is not a " system" as normally thought.

It points out companies that have increasing revenue, increasing profits, and increasing institutional ownership. Combine this with a relative low float and you get a HANS.

I have a friend who was in HANS at 40, she told me about it when it was 80. I thought is was too extended. It went to 200!!
She got out at the top. Had 3500 shares. Do the math.


A trader has to be careful as there are a lot of stocks that fit and most of us have limited capital.

I would suggest you learn the CANSLIM method and then modify it to suit your personal style.

Remember O'Neill has a huge institutional following of clients. We trade "traders".

Also, Dan Zanger uses a modified version of O'Neill.

Just my 2 cents worth

SteveD
 
toby, you might end up being right (about my being better off doing something else in the end), but I think you should read what I stated more closely. I actually de-emphasized the importance of becoming rich through trading. If it's something one is pursuing for a full-time goal, I would think the insistence on getting rich--especially anytime soon--would be a hindrance to surviving.
 
Quote from fttrader:

This is a great forum.

Bert,

I know where your're coming from. Disillusioned and wondering whether its worth continuing. I can tell you I was at the same point you are 5 years ago.

In fact I was at that point 3 times, each time after suffering severe and consistent losses. I can tell you it's just not worth it.

Do yourself a big favour, close your account, and concentrate on a proper career where you form relationships and where you can depend on a paycheck at the end of the month.
Your relationships, your health, your bank account, and your future will be better for it. Not to mention, if you have a family, they will thank you for it.

It's just too stressful, lonely, unhealthy and unrewarding an activity. As a business, well there are much better businessess to be in. Selling trading software, courses and advice might be one of them. Certainly seems to be a lot around.


Good luck.
Are you kidding? I have a normal career, and time for relationships and health is not more than it would be being a trader. What kind of career are you thinking about - hairdressing?
 
Quote from nzbryant:

Are you kidding? I have a normal career, and time for relationships and health is not more than it would be being a trader. What kind of career are you thinking about - hairdressing?

I think if you read between the lines,the poster was day trading and isolating himself in front of a screen,most likely in his own house....

If thats what you are doing and knocking the cover off the ball,thats great..But if you are earning sub t-bill rates or less than buy and hold,he is 100% right..imho
 
Have u tried the AIM system. I day trade the eMini but have a couple stocks for my grandkids that i use the AIM. Its more long term investment program but buys low and sells high. If you are interested look up Robert Lichello or AIM.:cool:
 
Quote from BertH:

I PM'd someone I respect on this, but decided to convey it to the board. Why? Not so that I could personally discourage anyone else from trying it--after all, I admit to being confused as hell right now. That's hardly a position to tell others what to do or not to do.

First of all, the title of my PM says it all--I've reached a point of deep disillusionment regarding my trading. While I've not actually lost from what I started in my account (gained small amount), it's been too erratic to have any real confidence in.
When I started this journey a couple of years ago, I could damn sure swear I saw significant patterns--repeated enough in a manner that--with discipline--would render strong profits over time.

Alas, the more and longer I dig in, the worse it gets (through more closely analyzing past data, seeing it more thoroughly, perhaps). I find that "setups" I thought put the odds strongly in my favor were a form of mirage--something that pulled me in, only to let me down in the end. It's not the market's job to make me happy; it's just that all the mega-hours and, especially, hopes I had seem dashed at this juncture. I'm an analytical sort with something of a mathematical mind. I believed I could beat this game, because I have pretty good discipline, and figured the analytical side would create some trading strategies that worked a heckuva lot more than they didn't. Instead, it just seems like a useless pull and tug, going in a circle and ending in the same spot.

I still believe--in the end--there's got to be some kind of system(s) that utilize and take advantage of the predictable patterns of human psychology. I thought I had some that could figure these patterns on the charts, but it's quite possibly all BS.

I'm just highly frustrated, disappointed, and disillusioned. I'm not sure if I'll resume this game at some point or not. Maybe it is largely a "random walk," and even when it's not "random," do we know when that time is coming or happening? Is it a tradable edge, enough to warrant making significant bucks from?

For those of you who have figured it out enough to be consistently profitable, definitely more power to ya. Maybe I'll get there someday, maybe I won't. Not sure what to do right now. I thought I loved this deeply at one point--now, I'm honestly not sure I have the stomach or patience.

Thanks for the ear regarding the ramble.
Bert
Frank Sinatra Song - That's Life!

That's life (that's life), that's what all the people say
You're ridin' high in April, shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune
When I'm back on top, back on top in June

I said that's life (that's life), and as funny as it may seem
Some people get their kicks stompin' on a dream
But I don't let it, let it get me down
'cause this fine old world, it keeps spinnin' around

I've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet, a pawn and a king
I've been up and down and over and out and I know one thing
Each time I find myself flat on my face
I pick myself up and get back in the race

That's life (that's life), I tell you I can't deny it
I thought of quitting, baby, but my heart just ain't gonna buy it
And if I didn't think it was worth one single try
I'd jump right on a big bird and then I'd fly

I've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet, a pawn and a king
I've been up and down and over and out and I know one thing
Each time I find myself layin' flat on my face
I just pick myself up and get back in the race

That's life (that's life), that's life and I can't deny it
Many times I thought of cuttin' out but my heart won't buy it
But if there's nothin' shakin' come this here July
I'm gonna roll myself up in a big ball a-and die

My, my!

http://www.extractando.com/entretenimiento/musica/Sinatra_ThatsLife_I.htm
 
Quote from Shazbatz30:

I dont know about everyone else here but I never use more then 2:1 margin. I do hold overnight positions though. I doubt anyone can trade over 4:1 margin and stomach the drawdowns. If someone can achieve less then a 5% drawdown in equity with over 4:1 margin then I have alot to learn still. But honestly I dont think this is achievable by too many :)

If you have a $200k and are using 2:1 margin to make a living then that's excellent, but if you are talking about a $20k account then yes, you have a lot to learn still.
 
Quote from Dustin:

... trading with margin ... up to 2000:1 (not a typo) or more.

Would like to gather information for the above.

Any pointers would be appreciated. TIA.
 
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