Dealing with micro-management

[HobbyTrading]

As I use Fibonacci for specific entries and exits on smaller time frames and it takes a lot of maintenance and price action monitoring. Not tiring though.

Instead of having your eyes glued to the screen to see the price action cross your Fibonacci levels you could set an audio alarm in your trading platform if the level is crossed. That will take the tension and stress away that you have to constantly monitor the screen.

 

[Leopard9]

Exactly, Fibonacci. Precision is the name of the game. OK, got it. I will investigate it for sure. Better yet, i just remembered i have the nasdaq CFD also wich is even better. Awsome. You are cool dude. Thanks!

 

[Leopard9]

Instead of having your eyes glued to the screen to see the price action cross your Fibonacci levels you could set an audio alarm in your trading platform if the level is crossed. That will take the tension and stress away that you have to constantly monitor the screen.

Yes true. I would have to sacrifice all the info I could get on the price reaction on any specific level, but yes. Stress saver.
Also i downloaded tekken 7 to keep my mind of the trade to play on screen one. Never got to do it though ahaha

 

[nooby_mcnoob]

The problem is exacerbated by using the wrong stops. Most want to enter the trade with too small a stop. How to pick stops and targets must be rule based and fit the market that is being traded

I agree. When people hear "risk 1-2% of your account on the trade" they put their stop so that they only lose 1-2% without considering the market.

You should use the ATR or some multiple of the standard deviation to set your stop and THEN size your bet according to the 1-2% rule. You cannot control where the market goes, but you know where it is likely to go.

 

[S-Trader]

To prove that the student had viable rules they are required to make 20 trades in a row without a loss. So if they have a loss on trade number 5 of the 20 they must start over on the series until they achieve 20 trades in a row.

Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that the student was required *to execute 20 trades flawlessly* (i.e., per their rules) as an exercise in discipline... but not "to make 20 trades without a loss" to "prove (they) had viable rules," which is a completely different animal.

(EDIT to correct/clarify after reviewing some of Douglas' stuff: In addition to the discipline aspect of the exercise (being able to follow your rules), I believe it was also intended to prove that they had a viable edge, and to demonstrate that they could think about trading properly, according to his "five fundamental truths." Although proving the edge is viable is in line with your post, I don't think he required the student to have 20 wins in a row.)

 

[MACD]

Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that the student was required *to execute 20 trades flawlessly* (i.e., per their rules) as an exercise in discipline... but not "to make 20 trades without a loss" to "prove (they) had viable rules," which is a completely different animal.

Great Catch @S-Trader. I have not read or reviewed "Trading in the Zone" or "The Disciplined Trader" for many years. (Not an excuse for the error -- which I accept). I thank you S-Trader for pointing this out and I apologize for my "completely different animal."

Not that it really matters, I like my "Animal" better. Yet I defer to your more recent read and understanding of the Books by Mark Douglas. Thanks.

 

[S-Trader]

Great Catch @S-Trader. I have not read or reviewed "Trading in the Zone" or "The Disciplined Trader" for many years. (Not an excuse for the error -- which I accept). I thank you S-Trader for pointing this out and I apologize for my "completely different animal."

Not that it really matters, I like my "Animal" better. Yet I defer to your more recent read and understanding of the Books by Mark Douglas. Thanks.

Naw, I haven't read those in a long time either -- did a quick skim to review when I saw this thread. So this was all valuable for me, as a reminder that it would greatly benefit me to read those again (for the ??th times). Seems like each time I do, new lightbulbs go off. Definitely haven't understood or embraced everything that I need to from his teachings, not by far...

Your "animal" -- I'm glad (or maybe not?) that I didn't have a mentor like you, who would require their student to get 20 wins in a row, lol. Maybe for something like perfecting shooting 3s, OK. But for trading? I'd either be waaay better, or have quit in discouragement a long time ago, lol. Take care...

 

[Dizaj]

I have heard somewhere that ST limit is actually a level of pain which one trader can stand. It sounds a little bit strange, but there is some true in it. Without a pain there is no gain . During the time and many, many deals made, you will find what generally works for you.

 

[Newc2]

Here are some interesting facts that may shed some light on "Micro Managing":

1. Mark Douglas insisted that his numerous students and book readers write out their RULES of trading. Specific rules for entering a trade, amount of risk (stops) that they would take on the trade and also the rules for targets to exit the trade with profits. To prove that the student had viable rules they are required to make 20 trades in a row without a loss. So if they have a loss on trade number 5 of the 20 they must start over on the series until they achieve 20 trades in a row.
   
2. Mr. Douglas wrote his books at the home of Larry Pesavento, who is one of the most respected author, teacher, and trader who has been in the industry for over 50 years. Larry's many books which include his many books on Fibonacci are considered very valuable explanations on "how-to" trade profitably are of great value. I point this out to illustrate the fact that Larry was present to discuss and "bounce-off" ideas as the writing progressed.
   
3. Pesavento's input directly enforced the "evils of micro-managing" Larry Absolutely does NOT manage his trades. Put the trade on with stops and targets and never look at it again. Larry says, "If I watch the trade, I will screw it up by micro-managing it."
   
4. To NOT micro-manage the trade you rely on your rules which you used to get into the trade. You stick with those rules. You made the right rule based trade, right stops, right targets and you must let the trade play out to achieve the proper profitable results.

The problem is exacerbated by using the wrong stops. Most want to enter the trade with too small a stop. How to pick stops and targets must be rule based and fit the market that is being traded. I say: Stops are Evil. I can prove that stops are unnecessary if one trades utilizing without stops then that alone eliminates most of the temptation to micro manage and ruin the trade. I can demonstate why this true in other threads or posts. For now how often have we put a trade on to make, say 2 or 3 points with a small stop of 1 or 2 point stops. Yes, this is why we see trades stopped out only to go profitable in the original direction and become profitable without us. (You, may say wow, trade without stops -- very dangerous). I can show you why it is not and in fact safer. Hedging methods are the answer instead of using some arbitrary or even what some call mental stops. (Sure, scream out loud "ridiculous stupidity")

Option hedges instead of stops eliminate any fears, emotions, and gaping over stops, or danger of market halts. How to use hedges is not hard to learn and use. No excuse not to use hedges. Margins are even lowered which reflects that the risks in the trade are less. (Ask the CME, which suggests margin relief to the brokers.

Sorry for the lengthy post -- I consider the OP was really wanting a solution and felt that I should be as clear as possible with the solution.

Don't like this then that is OK. Criticize, Bombard, or Question -- not a problem.
Thanks.

The biggest issue I still fight is when I enter a trade and I am underwater straight away. My stop hasn't been hit but it really annoys me and I have to fight myself not to exit before my stop is hit.

I know I have a positive expectancy over many trades but still it is a major issue for me.
I think this relates to micromanaging and why walking away from the screen might be the only thing to do after the stop loss has been put in place.

 

[maxinger]

I believe you micro manage / micro analyse AFTER (not before ) you enter the trade.
Many people including me face similar problem.

This has not nothing to do with technical analysis. It has got to do with psychology / mind management / subconscious mind.
The subconscious mind is causing havoc and it will run like an old broken tape every single day till we address it every single day.