Daytrading quickly becomes a bullsh*t job, and as such people justify it?

Quote from Fireplace:

So you will be providing YOUR track record from last year and this year in bonds for all of ET to see and also someone to verify your numbers are legit???
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There's a journal in ET with my profits last year.

I got into bonds not to speculate, but rather to get interests and shielding from a possible decline.
Although my bonds would benefit from a flight-to-quality.

I'm about to get a small % into leveraged ETFs (to benefit from the last stages of the uptrend without risking all your savings.

Quote from Lethn:

Anyone else find it funny that he's suddenly gone from being absolutely convinced that trading isn't a real job to defending it rabidly because he supposedly made a ton of money from the stock markets?

Get your head out of your arse CGarcia.
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I made money from long term sentiment trading (be greedy when the massesare fearful and viceversa).
Anyone can make money the same way too (as long as they have enough savings to invest during recessions)

Frequent trading only leads to losses, and I'm warning the naives about the scam.

Quote from financialmarket:

it's only b.s. job is you losing money daytrading. and account is only $5000 or less than $10,000...than you might as well get REAL JOB that pays the bills. i mean even $45,000/year is peanuts for profession or career...nothing impressive about making $45,000/year it's average income your not going to impress anyone with $45,000/year or even $100,000/year these days it's b.s. job cause of the income


it's not a b.s. job if you are making $500,000/year daytrading at the institutional level.
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There are not institutions that daytrade.
At least not serious and profitable ones.

Jim Cramer had a daytrading hedge fund and he blewup.

Quote from Fibbin-Archie:

Hmm, well you could say the same about being a corporate slave, working in an office with a bunch of bods you actually hate.
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At least corporate slaves pay the bills.

Not only daytrading (or frequent trading) doesn't pay the bills, but you are blowing up your savings.

Quote from sprinter:

Socially useful has nothing to do with it

retail trading is a great hobby and enjoyable

trying to make a living retail trading is pure stupidity. Without starting from wealth or having rich spouse or another income stream
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Finally some common sense in ET.

You must have $500k+, preferably $1M to make a living from trading/investing.

Quote from TrueProp:

It's a rare to encounter someone that is successful that spends a lot of time telling other people why they will not be successful.

Usually motivation-killing advice comes from people that have failed --- except for the honest people that realize that because they failed to succeed in an endeavor doesn't mean that everyone else is doomed to repeat their fate.

On that note, in my experience with large traders their big money is usually quiet money. So STFU.
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You must share the secret of your success, insted of being egoistic and hide it from society.

I share that you can make good money with long term sentiment investing.
You will lose all your time and money with frequent trading.
 
I agree with Garcia ,institutions don't daytrade. They accumulate oversold and sell overbought situations. Cheap commissions make you to overtrade, it doesn't add up boys ,but love this country, suckerroonies are everywhere.










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So play a longer TF then.

The blatant arrogance to think that just because you don't agree with a particular strategy means that no one else can use it profitably is absolutely appalling.

And as for trading sentiment, yeah great if you want to buy at the top and sell at the bottom.
 
Quote from crgarcia:


At least corporate slaves pay the bills.

Not only daytrading (or frequent trading) doesn't pay the bills, but you are blowing up your savings.
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You've quoted me out of context, I was replying to RobtF's point.
 
crgarcia,

In college, my only concept of trading was in holding positions for a few days to a few weeks at most (that was after my neighbor introduced me to William O'Neil's book and I stopped reading that damn Graham & Dodd book that got me nowhere fast).

I figured it was impossible to make money as a daytrader like all the academic white papers that I had read said----Until I started looking for a career as a trader and met career daytraders that had been in the business for years making insane money. I've been a daytrader for almost 4 years full-time and have seen about 4 different markets in my short career.

I don't argue that taking large size for a few points over a few days is preferable to taking large size for .40 to .60+ cents intraday in terms of lifestyle and profits in some cases. Eventually that is where I will be full-time (hopefully by 30). However, through daytrading, I have had the opportunity to see the relevance in the relationship b/w shorter-term timeframes and longer-term timeframes (i.e. S/R on a 15-min 10 day chart in the context of a daily chart and an intraday chart for that matter).

There is value in daytrading. Ask Renaissance Capital. Ask any hedge fund making a killing in HF Trading. I have a list of friends of mine that you could ask as well but none of them would really be open to answering your questions.

Trading is a tough job no matter the timeframe.
 
Quote from TrueProp:

crgarcia,

In college, my only concept of trading was in holding positions for a few days to a few weeks at most (that was after my neighbor introduced me to William O'Neil's book and I stopped reading that damn Graham & Dodd book that got me nowhere fast).

I figured it was impossible to make money as a daytrader like all the academic white papers that I had read said----Until I started looking for a career as a trader and met career daytraders that had been in the business for years making insane money. I've been a daytrader for almost 4 years full-time and have seen about 4 different markets in my short career.

I don't argue that taking large size for a few points over a few days is preferable to taking large size for .40 to .60+ cents intraday in terms of lifestyle and profits in some cases. Eventually that is where I will be full-time (hopefully by 30). However, through daytrading, I have had the opportunity to see the relevance in the relationship b/w shorter-term timeframes and longer-term timeframes (i.e. S/R on a 15-min 10 day chart in the context of a daily chart and an intraday chart for that matter).

There is value in daytrading. Ask Renaissance Capital. Ask any hedge fund making a killing in HF Trading. I have a list of friends of mine that you could ask as well but none of them would really be open to answering your questions.

Trading is a tough job no matter the timeframe.
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All this anti Day-trading stuff is what the media spoon feeds the herd mentality. Journalists are the biggest "schmucks" going, the majority of them don't know the first thing about the world of finance and most probably couldn't trade their way out of a soggy paper bag.

Day-trading has roughly the same start up failure rate as any other small business. Most of that percentage likely wash-out because they don't scale position size according to account size and don't employ money management, i.e. too much exposure to risk, it's like laying on the tracks waiting for the train to come.

As I said in another thread, it's possibly a necessary evil to get burned at least once to learn the importance of these two disciplines.

It's happened to me as to many independents, but I didn't quit, I learned from it, went back worked on my market knowledge and on my attitudes, saved another account and got back in the game.
 
Learning to day trade actually helps swing trading too because the former is relatively difficult and involves quick decisions.

Folks who day trade successfully are mostly very good at swing trading but the reverse isn't true.


So that's how I justify the bullshit job of day trading crgarcia

:D

Cheers,
Max
 
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