Day trading is losers game

dom993 · Apr 8, 2012

One lose much more slowly trading off weekly charts, for sure.

Can we all agree that day-trading is a negative-sum game, and as a result, there is necessarily more money lost than won at that game?

On the other hand, I have yet to be convinced that multi-days/weeks/months trading is any better (ie. a true zero-sum game or even better a positive-sum game), even in stocks.

Brass · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from dom993:

One lose much more slowly trading off weekly charts, for sure.

Can we all agree that day-trading is a negative-sum game, and as a result, there is necessarily more money lost than won at that game?

On the other hand, I have yet to be convinced that multi-days/weeks/months trading is any better (ie. a true zero-sum game or even better a positive-sum game), even in stocks.

All futures and other derivative trading is zero sum (minus costs) because for every contract or unit held long there is a contract or unit held short by someone else.

RCG Trader · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from Xspurt:

So you mean if I put several charts and some of them were Fx and the others were stocks, you'd know the difference if you couldn't see which were which. After all if they behave differently and the Fx charts don't require as much precision or accuracy, telling the difference would be a piece of cake.

I'd like to see the proof of this theory as it sounds like a losing day traders fantasy. I hear this all the time about different markets and also that it's all noise on the 1m chart so stick with the big time frames, but no one ever seems to want to prove how accurate or precise or factual their reasoning is.

Wanna step up to the plate?

It's like saying day trading is a loser game, therefore you'd know an intraday 1min chart from weekly chart because somehow the rules are different for each time frame. You'd be a loser if you can't tell the difference between a stock and an Fx chart or a weekly and a 1 min chart. Huh?

I think what he meant was the FX charts do tend to be smoother. No gaps, and barring a defualt, your currency spread won't go to zero.

Unless you like the CHF or the JPY, there is less chance for disaster.

RCG Trader · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from Brass:

I don't trade currencies, so I won't pretend to know. But I didn't think any market was immune from significant and unexpected events that would be characterized as black swans.

No, you are correct, there will be Swans in every market, but currencies tend to be mean reverting, so the trick is from my experience, if you wake up and the central bank has decided something, simply trade around that position as it will most likely revert.

RCG Trader · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from Brass:

I'm not sure I follow. I would think that the higher the leverage, the more precise you would want to be, and forex offers 100-to-1 leverage.

Some shops offer 400-1 leverage. Here in the states, the best we can get is 50-1

RCG Trader · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from oilfxpro:

There are custom indicators

All indicators do the same thing, they take a chunk of price and interpret that chunk based on some sort of parameters.

The fastest indicator is price. Not saying other indicators do not work, but reading price is by far the fastest way to find out what is going on.

RCG Trader · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from shopster:

is this a trend change.

i did not see a diverged double bottom with a zero lag cross...............

s

Interesting way to use the MACD.

dom993 · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from Brass:

All futures and other derivative trading is zero sum (minus costs)

and that's why it is a negative-sum game.

Make an estimate of how much these "costs" amount in a day on your favorite market ... that's how much market participants collectively lose on a daily basis to exchanges & brokers, and that amount must be put in the market *every day* by the markets participants as a whole.

RCG Trader · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from dom993:

and that's why it is a negative-sum game.

Make an estimate of how much these "costs" amount in a day on your favorite market ... that's how much market participants collectively lose on a daily basis to exchanges & brokers, and that amount must be put in the market *every day* by the markets participants as a whole.

Well, my account for one, keeps growing. Two pips is a small price to pay for the opportunity to participate in the largest market on earth.

oilfxpro · Apr 8, 2012

Quote from dom993:

and that's why it is a negative-sum game.

Make an estimate of how much these "costs" amount in a day on your favorite market ... that's how much market participants collectively lose on a daily basis to exchanges & brokers, and that amount must be put in the market *every day* by the markets participants as a whole.

If u picked the right instrument to trade in the right direction , there is capital appreciation in the long run , as well as short term volatility.Long Gold is a prime EXCEPTION to the zero sum game because in the long term it will be higher at $5,000 per oz.

It is more than a zero sum game with gold ,Governments are printing money and honouring I O U 's with new bigger I O U to pay for the old I O U.

http://drpetersnews.com/gold-price-forecast-trend-chart-2011-2012-2013-2014-2015-2016.html