Day trading as a living should be impossible

Quote from denner:

The reality is that even if you could achieve the kind of returns you propose, that outlier event (as cliched as it sounds in this day at age to talk about)...whether it be an FOMC Announcement, some piece of new market legislation (outlawing shorts in financials), a "flash crash", quite literally anything and they occur at least once a year could literally knock you out.

That's becoming more and more of an issue and I don't see that getting any better. Personally, I think these sort of discussions are about a decade late. The trading landscape (aside from the guys on the frontlines of HFT or really successful algorithmic traders) is completely barren. The volume speaks to it as does the overall malaise and apathy that I've seen on forums in recent years.
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It's called day trading for a reason. You're typically flat overnight so as to not be exposed to the "outlier events" that you speak of...and you stand ready to make trades when crazy things happen during the day.

I wish there was a flash crash every day, that was real easy money.
 
Quote from TradingScrub:


I wish there was a flash crash every day, that was real easy money.
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That's what I wish too. There will be big money opportunities. But I wouldn't say it's real easy money. It takes a lot of guts (and experiences definitely help) to trade in those environments.

I miss 2008. :)
 
There are opportunities right now for good money without needing to day trade. Just need to know where to look and where they are.

Although I agree the vol was great while it lasted.
 
Quote from abdul_mcgee:

If you are trading a 3X ETF, the leverage is built-in to the stock. Why take on the leverage risk yourself?

Maybe my calculations are wrong but you can expect similar results if you have 3X leverage (good luck with that) in a SPY-like stock or a 3X bull/bear like TNA/TZA.
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You use other peoples leverage. Such as with a prop firm like bright. Otherwise you are correct. It's impossible unless you get extraordinarily lucky
 
Quote from Eight:

There are people with weird thinking processes everywhere... I knew one guy that liked Fords, Fords were the only car that deserved any reality in his thinking, the worst Ford was better than the best of anything else... one day I loaned him wifey's TBird and I led the way in my (muchly suspension-modified) Camaro. I took a turn that I knew the TBird could not do and he spun out... there was no other way to tell him anything...

There is no sense telling them anything and if you did, they would say it was a fluke or whatever...
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Please, tell me more :)
 
Quote from Hylifejoker:

You use other peoples leverage. Such as with a prop firm like bright. Otherwise you are correct. It's impossible unless you get extraordinarily lucky
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Wait, what do you mean by I am correct and it is impossible?

Say there is a 6% median in a bull 3x and further, say you are right 40% of the time. I hope that is not out of the ballpark for good traders.

Now if we use the rule of 60, that is, I don't pick tops or bottoms but make money in the 60% in between, that is a full 3.6% position swing possible on a median day (average is similar). Do you mean to tell me that if you could even get 1% of that, it is not possible?

So what are you doing on this site? Do you make money from trading?
 
You are not getting it. Put up 25 to 50k at bright. Get access to millions in buying power. That's what it takes to make it. The real strategies that make real money demand big capital. Otherwise you are just guessing with overoptimistic and unrealistic expectations.
 
Quote from TradingScrub:

It's called day trading for a reason. You're typically flat overnight so as to not be exposed to the "outlier events" that you speak of...and you stand ready to make trades when crazy things happen during the day.

I wish there was a flash crash every day, that was real easy money.
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I guess that you were born yesterday. The outlier events that I referred to happen exclusively INTRA-DAY and before you started trading 6 months ago, it's a head's you win, tails you lose in so far as whether you are lucky or unlucky enough to be positioned on the right side of some surprise announcement.
 
Quote from abdul_mcgee:

Thanks.

I don't trust the market over long periods of time. I want to be in cash at the end of every day, profit or loss.

A few days last week, I did some intra day paper trading. My net is about $8K on my risk capital of $100K. Of course, this says nothing about long term prospects but it does excite me to the possibilities. I only aim to make one trade a day in one 3x ETF and then close up shop.


Is there hope for me?
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I think you shouldn't use last week as a reference, anybody betting long made good money. I made around 9% on the Hang Saeng, without trading at all, and well over 10% in US stocks with a few daytrades in the mix and definetely without much of a clue of the market - got crushed the week before :(

Better do further paper trades during more challenging periods.

As of your spending for a family of 4, I actually find it low, but expecting to ensure that income from only 100k capital and day trading sounds quite far fetched.
 
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