Concealed Carrying Bystander Nearly Killed Innocent Man During Tucson Shooting

[OPTIONAL777]

So your vision is for every man, woman and child to be walking around the mall with a military-spec assault rifle...

Quote from TD80:

Please tell that to the families of millions of victims of Joseph Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Various African, Central American, and Latin American regimes.

What I find absurd is that these populations allowed themselves to be disarmed, and then subsequently slaughtered and terrorized by powerful central governments.

Nobody is saying you should have a functioning howitzer parked out back. I'm sure even in the 1700s, having heavy cannon at your personal disposal was probably frowned upon.

I personally feel we would all be better off if each adult citizen was issued a military-spec assault rifle, similar to what Switzerland has in place.

 

[OPTIONAL777]

The "freaks" are those who look to the constitution and think it is an instrument to force their will and values on others.

I said the extremes of either the right and left, not reasonable people.

Remember, moderation is the way...not rigid, dogmatic, fundamentalist self righteousness...

Quote from tomdavis:

To some people (e.g., Chicago and DC politicans, the Brady organization, etc.), gun control means a total ban on hand guns.

To other people (like me), gun control simply means laws that prohibit sales of guns to criminals and the mentally ill.

There is no agreed-upon meaning of gun control.

Also, if you dismiss people who look to the Constitution as "freaks," is there any basis for discussion?

 

[TD80]

Yes of course, just like Switzerland. That wasn't a teddy bear that 5 year old was cuddling in Gstaad, it was an H&K Assault Rifle with teddy bear camo...

Quote from OPTIONAL777:

So your vision is for every man, woman and child to be walking around the mall with a military-spec assault rifle...

 

[wjk]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:


No one knows what the constitution means.

Some might take that to mean we don't really have one.

Certainly we have to take modern times into account, but one thing has never changed...there are those who wish to control the actions of others (and they tend to gravitate toward positions of power), and without the Constitution such actions might go unchecked. What better way to get around the restraints than to say we don't know what the Constitution means.

 

[TD80]

Quote from tomdavis:


Also... if you dismiss people who look to the Constitution as "freaks," is there any basis for discussion?

Again, this is a clever man who has laid it all out for you in very simple, common sense ways including this statement. I'm proud to say (I believe?) he is a fellow Californian and we could certainly use about 30 million more of him.

 

[OPTIONAL777]

Why don't you move to Switzerland, since that seems to be your vision of utopia?

Quote from TD80:

Yes of course, just like Switzerland. That wasn't a teddy bear that 5 year old was cuddling in Gstaad, it was an H&K Assault Rifle with teddy bear camo...

 

[tomdavis]

When I lawfully purchase and/or carry a gun, how am I "forcing my will and values on others?" Whose rights have I violated?

Quote from OPTIONAL777:

The "freaks" are those who look to the constitution and think it is an instrument to force their will and values on others.

I said the extremes of either the right and left, not reasonable people.

Remember, moderation is the way...not rigid, dogmatic, fundamentalist self righteousness...

 

[wjk]

Quote from tomdavis:


To other people (like me), gun control simply means laws that prohibit sales of guns to criminals and the mentally ill.

+1

 

[Lucrum]

Quote from OPTIONAL777:

Yes, you just expressed your opinion.

Any time you are willing to make a reasoned sensible civil argument, let me know...

You, civil argument?

Will it look anything like this?

 

[OPTIONAL777]

People take it many different ways.

The right way (IMO) is majority rule, without trampling the rights of the minority.

The simple fact, is that you don't really know what the Constitution means...you are like many who want to confuse opinion with fact.

Yes, the words are right there...but words and not mathematical equations. The Framers knew that, which is why they made it a living framework, subject to interpretation and amendment.

Imagine if we had to actually think for ourselves....

Quote from wjk:

Some might take that to mean we don't really have one.

Certainly we have to take modern times into account, but one thing has never changed...there are those who wish to control the actions of others (and they tend to gravitate toward postitions of power), and without the Constitution such actions might go unchecked. What better way to get around the restraints than to say we don't know what the Constitution means.