Complain Here About E-mini "order Mistakes"

TheCaracal · Jul 15, 2003

Quote from CalTrader:

My comment on all of this is equivalent to my previous posts on similar problems with CME markets: No matter how liquid these markets are, if the CME continues to have problems like this in maintaining an orderly market in any of their contracts then firms and people that have a choice will move their business to other exchanges and markets.

Each of these incidents serves to erode confidence in the CME's mangement, particularly with all the changes they have made since they put together their IPO.

You would never know this from the CME stock chart; 52W Hi ... again.

Denial is thick. Volume I guess; is thicker than reality.

David

slapshot · Jul 16, 2003

Quote from CaroKann:

the difference is, nobody breaks those trades.

My point exactly: If a person has a position that takes advantage of the move and manages to stay in until it bottoms (or tops out), they would have a huge profit taken away by the busted trades -while still having assumed the risk of putting on the trade in the first place. Then they have an open position when they thought they were flat.

If I'm wrong about this then someone please (politely) correct me.

Also, how about the other traders that get burned in NQ trades or even MSFT or some other unrelated/loosely related instrument? No one comes in to break their trades...

Also, I thought I read somewhere that there was a maximum size limit that any one trader could put in at any one time for E-mini's - is this true?

Thanks,

Paul

slapshot · Jul 16, 2003

Quote from stock777:

Just for the record, the market is manipulated all day. You're simply seeing what happens when thier fingers slip, they get bored taking small chunks, or some new player gets involved that has no finesse.

However, what happens during these spikes can hardly be called a "fair and orderly market" - apparently the Powers That BE agree enough to break trades over it...

Peace,

Paul

slapshot · Jul 16, 2003

Quote from FasterPussycat:

you're right - i apologize for the flippant remarks.

Thank You.

Paul

Uni · Jul 16, 2003

Quote from slapshot:

I am the first one to agree with you about embracing risk - however....

Apparently, you must be unaware of what has been happening lately with E-mini trading - as soon as you are affected by it, then you'll feel different.

PS I have not been affected by it, but these so-called "order-entry" mistakes are bullshit and obviously intentional - sooner or later, all traders will be affected by it if it is not stopped, even people trading unrelated indexes or stocks - the point of this was to voice our concerns to the governing agents that we want them to keep a lid on blatant market manipulations.

Respecfully,

Paul

Point taken and I am aware of what has been happening lately with emini trading. I just don't believe "voicing concerns to governing agents" is going to amount to anything more than squat (unless Elliott Spitzer decides to take up the case

). These are freely marketed products and if one thinks that they are being intentionally misused or misrepresented, they are welcome to vote with their feet. As for unrelated issues being affected, the market will take care of that. I don't think the big boys want to lose the liquidity provided by the retailers.

-Uni

slapshot · Jul 16, 2003

Quote from Uni:

Point taken and I am aware of what has been happening lately with emini trading. I just don't believe "voicing concerns to governing agents" is going to amount to anything more than squat (unless Elliott Spitzer decides to take up the case ). These are freely marketed products and if one thinks that they are being intentionally misused or misrepresented, they are welcome to vote with their feet. As for unrelated issues being affected, the market will take care of that. I don't think the big boys want to lose the liquidity provided by the retailers.

-Uni

Agreed that "squat" defines the odds of any substantive reform.

But, if individual Traders don't represent themselves, then who will represent them?

Change and reform is often slow and it takes multiple events to create a process - IMO, we owe it to ourselves to put in our .02 to regulatory agencies when appropriate as these types of events occur.

Otherwise it'll just get worse for everyone except the offenders.

Regards,

Paul (aka Don Quiote)

PS <sigh> Perhaps I just feel like Tilting at Windmills lately

slapshot · Jul 16, 2003

Quote from Uni:

Point taken and I am aware of what has been happening lately with emini trading. I just don't believe "voicing concerns to governing agents" is going to amount to anything more than squat (
-Uni

(This is the text of the reply letter I received after I e-mailed and complained - )

Dear "angry futures trader":

Thank you for your e-mail of July 15, 2003 concerning the busting of trades
in the e-mini markets. We are reviewing the circumstances surrounding such
events and greatly appreciate your views and comments on the issue. We will
certainly take them into consideration as we proceed with our review. The
Commission is committed to ensuring fair and orderly markets and the
protection of market users and the public from fraud, manipulation and
abusive trading practices, and you can be assured that we will thoroughly
review this matter. Again, thank you for your comments.

Richard W. Q. Fung
Chief, Market Compliance Branch
Division of Market Oversight
Commodity Futures Trading Commission

(Although obviously a form letter, at least they took the time to reply)

Riskmanager · Jul 17, 2003

Thank God american lawyers werenÂ´t invented yet when the big meteorite hit planet earth some 60 mln. years ago - imagine the dinosaurs suing us mammals for taking an unfair advantage...