Collective2 - Any experience with this as a signal provider?

Laissez Faire said:
This got me confused.

I thought C2 would simply mirror or report the actual executed trades/executions in my main account? As I understand it, pending limit or market orders are not reported.



Yes. I imagine it won't be valuable or profitable for someone to follow a day trader who's quickly in and out of the market.
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Sorry for the confusion. You are correct. There are 3 types of executed orders and reported:

1) Your Live account
2) Your Live Subscribers accounts
3) You Sim C2 account.

Theoretically all three should be the same fills within a tick or two and nearly all at the same time within a second or two.

But what happens when they are not? The Syncc engine kicks in and tries to get them all in the same Long or Short position. This is all good and Matt et al has done a good job given the task at hand.

I had a fast market trade* a few days ago as an example. Went short, and 1 second later someone dumped 4.5K contracts. My target was hit 2.5 points down and I was out. A 2 second trade.

Here is what would-could have happened in C2.

My IB executes just fine
Subscriber 1 fills open.
Subscriber 2 does not fill to open. (or fills late)
C2 goes to close-go flat
Subscriber 1 fills to close
Subscriber 2 fills to OPEN a Long.
C2 10-30 seconds later see Subscriber 2 should be Flat, and closes.

Meanwhile in that time I have placed another trade. Chaos ensues. I just wanted to trade not manage this mess. Basically, every possible combination of out of synnc can happen. And you cannot tell because the reporting is delayed. FYI I placed about 150 trades Live with subscribers. Error rate over 4 days was 3, 4, 9, 2. The last day the 2 were really bad and I was getting "auto whip sawed" by C2 in the subscriber accounts.

Some strategies will work, some will not. And you have to test it LIVE with subscriber accounts.

PS: I tried using the C2 interface, limited as it is, and could not find a solution to the above.
* If you know ES, you also know this happens 6-10 time a day.
 
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LF,
There are other system that bundle all the order of the traders and the subscribers account together. This way what ever is filled the results are shared. It was a large financial commitment to use their system, something like 5K a month. I was not ready for that commitment just to help some friends out.
 
Thank you for that detailed and informative reply, Bad_Badness.

Bad_Badness said:
There are 3 types of executed orders and reported:

1) Your Live account
2) Your Live Subscribers accounts
3) You Sim C2 account.
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I understand.

If my main interest is a track record and tracking performance - can I filter based on my own live account only?
 
Collective2 is a good idea but unfortunately it is executed badly. It is pretty restricted in the types of orders you can use on futures as well as options and executions can be be sluggish at times which if you are in a slow market it not so much a problem but in a volatile market can be very much a problem


Laissez Faire said:
Hello all,

I've heard of Collective2 for many years and have always thought it was geared towards system traders, but seems like it's open to all types of traders. I also see that it allegedly integrates seamlessly with my current broker and software (Ninjatrader Brokerage / NT8).

If I have understood correctly, I can simply trade like I normally do and my executions will automatically submit to C2.

As a day trader of futures who both take quick scalps and will hold for hours at times, I'm not sure if my type of trading would be compatible with C2?

My own motivation for using this service would be to a) add some extra income; b) build a track record. If it's easy to use/integrate and a low effort to implement it seems like it can be worthwhile considering.

Just figured I'd throw it out there and hear what the good people of ET have to say about this service.

Thanks in advance.
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