Classified docs contradict Nunes surveillance claims, GOP and Dem sources say

[piezoe]

There is a massive inconsistency, and there have been low level complaints from the beginning that he was appointing establishment figures. Partly I think he did it because he respects highly accomplished people, whether they are business tycoons or generals. He is not so vain that he doesn't want to have experienced and highly competent people advising him. Part of it was an attempt both to rebut criticism that he was dangerously radical and to facilitate finding common ground with the establishments of both parties.

Nothing wrong with that, and it stands in marked contrast to Obama, who appointed only fellow far left radicals, mostly minorities. But now it seems the establishment tail is beginning to wag the swamp draining dog. Poor Bannon has become the symbolic gauge of which side is winning, and he is getting pulled back and forth like a chew toy between two puppies.

This situation was always the danger of electing a novice who had not spent decades in the public policy wars.

There is another aspect unfortunately, which is his family. He didn't select them, but he is devoted to them. That gives us a situation where he is vulnerable to emotional manipulation, even if unintentional. And it creates an unfair playing field for those who might oppose a family member's ideas. Many have heard the famous words ("You're fired") after too many disagreements with a family member.

For the Trump children, protecting the Trump business brand has to be a primary objective. Ivanka doesn't like being called a racist bigot and having her clothing line dropped over boycotts. Then there's the hotel business. Cooperation with local governments is crucial, here or abroad. So they prefer a more congenial approach and more centrist objectives than Bannon.

None of this is the end of the world. Trump is a smart guy and should be able to figure it out.

Your view of what's happening seems to be well supported by what we can observe from the outside. In the end I'm guessing there are going to be many of his ardent supporters that are going to be very disappointed. But it is very, very early in his administration. We'll have a much better idea of how far he can go toward fulfilling his campaign promises 18 months from now. My guess is its going to be a holy mess and a total disaster for the Republican party. But take heart. It is only a wild guess on my part. And believe me, I am used to being wrong. I thought the guy had a snowballs chance in hell of being elected, though I didn't want Hillery either. (I voted for her because I thought Trump would be much worse. I didn't get a chance to vote for my favorite candidate, Bernie.) Look how wrong I was! Trump got elected despite the election being rigged, according to him. I see him as a door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen who inherited a lot of money and used it to buy compliments. By that I mean who in their right mind would put up with this guy if he couldn't buy them stuff? He's going to parlay his four years into four years of bragging and golf vacations at our expense.

Let me add this, I truly hope he turns out to be half as wonderful as he says he is. That would be enough for me.

 

[fhl]

Trump got elected despite the election being rigged, according to him.

Actually, the election was rigged against your candidate by your own party. And now your party has also spent the past four months ginning up phony evidence and accusations that the election was rigged for trump.

I wonder how those two points got left out of your analysis.

 

[piezoe]

Actually, the election was rigged against your candidate by your own party.

It's true, that it was rigged against Bernie. (that part was established with the resignation of Debbie ) But somehow I don't think that's what Trump had in mind when he said "The election is rigged."

When there is an investigation going on, behind the scenes out of the public eye, my own thing is to wait for any conclusions. But that's just me. I don't mind saying though that it would surprise me if Trump had anything directly to do with Russian interference on his behalf. What the investigation seems to be about is who was involved, and who knew. We'll have to wait to find that out. We already know that Manafort, Trumps campaign manager in an earlier phase, was at one point, before going to work for Trump, being paid to represent Russian interests.That is already clearly established. It is somewhat curious that Manafort offered to manage Trumps campaign for nothing. The last time I heard of that happening was in high school. But did he know about any Russian election related hacking? We'll just have to wait.

 

[java]

some of the government's most competent employees and with them important institutional knowledge.

If they are so competent why didn't they write it down instead of taking it with them?

 

[fhl]

It's true, that it was rigged against Bernie. (that part was established with the resignation of Debbie ) But somehow I don't think that's what Trump had in mind when he said "The election is rigged."

When there is an investigation going on, behind the scenes out of the public eye, my own thing is to wait for any conclusions. But that's just me. I don't mind saying though that it would surprise me if Trump had anything directly to do with Russian interference on his behalf. What the investigation seems to be about is who was involved, and who knew. We'll have to wait to find that out. We already know that Manafort, Trumps campaign manager in an earlier phase, was at one point, before going to work for Trump, being paid to represent Russian interests.That is already clearly established. It is somewhat curious that Manafort offered to manage Trumps campaign for nothing. The last time I heard of that happening was in high school. But did he know about any Russian election related hacking? We'll just have to wait.

Should I reply now or are you going to edit this another two or three times?


Manafort's partner was managing Mccain's campaign while the two of them's firm was representing the russians.
Kind of curious that there doesn't seem to be any investigation into that. Actually, it's not curious at all because everyone knows what this whole thing is about.

And I don't care. Trump could have had millions of pitchforks standing up for him and kept these lying bastids from running him out of town, but now he's turned his back on them so he's got nobody with his back. When they start indicting ham sandwiches he's going to be all by his lonesome except for hannity. Tough for him. Trump brought me out of voting retirement to vote again but now he's squandered that and i'm back to hoping that the entire edifice crumbles to the ground. The sooner the better.

 

[piezoe]

Ha ha ha . You caught me! I have a bad habit of editing after I push submit. I can't seem to read what I have written unless I get away for a few minutes. Just something I can't explain.

We don't know what is being investigated exactly, or where the investigation is leading. That's the point.

I like your forthrightness!

Pop on up to Economics and read the tremendously interesting commentary on Putin and the Russian economy I just posted . Really interesting!!!

 

[piezoe]

The important commentary From Feb of last year on Putin and the Russian and EU problems has been for some inexplicable reason moved to politics, you can find it in this Forum by scrolling down to 'Putin is no Ally...' important reading for anyone speculating in the ruble or Russian securities.

 

[fhl]

What if the laws that Congress has written about the CIA have delegated congressional power to a small secret committee of members from both houses of Congress and both political parties? What if that committee can authorize secret wars in foreign lands conducted not by the military but by the CIA? What if the reason these folks authorize the CIA and not the military to conduct secret wars is the existence of federal laws that require reporting to and a vote of the entire Congress for the military to be used but require only the small secret committee to approve for the CIA to be used?

 

[java]

What if the laws that Congress has written about the CIA have delegated congressional power to a small secret committee of members from both houses of Congress and both political parties? What if that committee can authorize secret wars in foreign lands conducted not by the military but by the CIA? What if the reason these folks authorize the CIA and not the military to conduct secret wars is the existence of federal laws that require reporting to and a vote of the entire Congress for the military to be used but require only the small secret committee to approve for the CIA to be used?

Where can I buy one of those small secret committee members?

 

[fhl]

Where can I buy one of those small secret committee members?

The committee members themselves aren't secret but everything they discuss is top secret and classified. They are the only ones with clearance to see what the cia is up to. We're trusting the so called gang of eight to make sure that the wars the cia conducts are proper. And it's all in secret.