Citadel first Hedge Fund to sell Bonds ($2 billion)
- Thread starter JayS
- Start date
Take Solomon's advice. The hedge becomes a [greater] liability under any margin call, which would likely result in a loss of investment grade and default. As it stands, the bonds are one to two ticks away from junk; and this is under the current "blue sky" scenario. You know "Ken" about as well as you know Santa.
When will you be making your donation and how much can I put you down for? I don't doubt that you're an intelligent person, but the need to be right and express opinions makes asses out of so many people in this business.
I haven't any use in purchasing this bond, so I haven't looked at the red herring and cannot comment on the details of the debt. But that doesn't impact the justification for this move.
This is a hedge (bond debt) that Citadel could utilize during a substantial squeeze if it came to down to it. That situation hasn't confronted Citadel yet, but in the event that it did they would have an additional layer of defense in place to protect investor assets. This is a risk-management TOOL that compliments an already effective system...not the only tool in the box.
I agree with your assessment that giving additional leverage to an undercapitalized fund would just compound the loss. However, the list of institutions that can come after Citadel is a short one. Furthermore, I have zero doubt that in such an unlikely event as the one you suggest as inevitable that Ken would make a trading decision AGAIN and take the loss on the position(s).
As for your parting comment, would it make the ignorant responses more intelligent if I said they were neighbors, or we were college buddies, or we grew up in FL together, or Anne is a friend of my fiance's? I don't know who you are and you don't know who I am. I'm pleased to say that it will stay that way.
FYI, I met Santa at an early age...turns out he was my father!
Merry Christmas
I haven't any use in purchasing this bond, so I haven't looked at the red herring and cannot comment on the details of the debt. But that doesn't impact the justification for this move.
This is a hedge (bond debt) that Citadel could utilize during a substantial squeeze if it came to down to it. That situation hasn't confronted Citadel yet, but in the event that it did they would have an additional layer of defense in place to protect investor assets. This is a risk-management TOOL that compliments an already effective system...not the only tool in the box.
I agree with your assessment that giving additional leverage to an undercapitalized fund would just compound the loss. However, the list of institutions that can come after Citadel is a short one. Furthermore, I have zero doubt that in such an unlikely event as the one you suggest as inevitable that Ken would make a trading decision AGAIN and take the loss on the position(s).
As for your parting comment, would it make the ignorant responses more intelligent if I said they were neighbors, or we were college buddies, or we grew up in FL together, or Anne is a friend of my fiance's? I don't know who you are and you don't know who I am. I'm pleased to say that it will stay that way.
FYI, I met Santa at an early age...turns out he was my father!
Merry Christmas
Sorry this is exactly what I pointed at, so please don't f*cking re-word it making it look like your own thoughts. I am a trader and not some scam advertising pusher like you. I say things the way I see them, using traderâs language, so please bugger off you POS Citadel promoter.
Btw, who the f*ck gives a shit about what King Solomon had to say? Have you seen him recently? I think you do in your dreams on a daily basis... Do you know what probability there is about him ever existed? I say 10% LOL
I would love shorting this Citadel train. If you have funds there get at least the 1/2 out NOW and thank me later. This thing smells high yield, junk, and investment grade shit.
Btw, who the f*ck gives a shit about what King Solomon had to say? Have you seen him recently? I think you do in your dreams on a daily basis... Do you know what probability there is about him ever existed? I say 10% LOL
I would love shorting this Citadel train. If you have funds there get at least the 1/2 out NOW and thank me later. This thing smells high yield, junk, and investment grade shit.
I suspect smart money is contemplating to leave and is issuing notices, ouch, and Citadel is estimating that no more then 2Bil, in total (I say double that), should leave the fund in the foreseeable future. Refco rings a bell, right?
I assume that you know what happens when the returns move away from your estimated mean 5 to 10 sigmas? LTCM is a good example, so please bare that in mind.
You know what, better be ready when they, no no it isn't a Santa this time, start knocking on the door for more margin and Citadel better have lots of it.
Sorry but this stinks...
I assume that you know what happens when the returns move away from your estimated mean 5 to 10 sigmas? LTCM is a good example, so please bare that in mind.
You know what, better be ready when they, no no it isn't a Santa this time, start knocking on the door for more margin and Citadel better have lots of it.
Sorry but this stinks...
Banjo, they f***ing better consider they risk if and when crude hits $35 and the rest of the group follows the same fate at corr. 1.0. Shell I say 80 degrees dive across the board?
They better think 2ice before they succeed in cornering the e'gies markets, as probabilities in similar operations are close to zero!!!
Interesting times aheadâ¦
They better think 2ice before they succeed in cornering the e'gies markets, as probabilities in similar operations are close to zero!!!
Interesting times aheadâ¦
WinDiff, you are very dumb.
"Cornering the energy markets"? wtf?
Citadel made roughly $2B taking down Amaranth's book. They'd monetized half of it in the first week. You don't do that unless you're a) very technically sophisticated, and b) very savvy traders.
They're not some dipshit mean reversion pairs shop.
"Cornering the energy markets"? wtf?
Citadel made roughly $2B taking down Amaranth's book. They'd monetized half of it in the first week. You don't do that unless you're a) very technically sophisticated, and b) very savvy traders.
They're not some dipshit mean reversion pairs shop.
